Please, please, don't go see Transformers 2

[Reepicheep]

Saying things like ?It?s not supposed to be brilliant, just don't think too much and you'll enjoy it!?  doesn't really help. Sorry but, ?turn your brain off? and ?have fun? are directly contradictory. It's kind of insulting to suggest to someone that you need to be stupid to enjoy any activity, not just to yourself but to themselves as well.

I?m not going to give any movie a break and pretend I?m stupid just because it has expensive special FX, hot women, and is based on something that, while patently unrealistic, could be something so much better.

It?s sort of a sad statement about entertainment when movies of this quality do so well, and then things that are too 'thinky' are panned. It?s just giving studios reasons to abandon plot, acting, characterisation, and reasoning in favor of hot girls bending over, s*** blowing up, and crappy 'humor'.

hear, hear.

[Kommando]

I have to take the other route.  I saw it and enjoyed it.  I went with friends, we had a good time.  Sam's mother was probably the best character in the movie.  It had a story which could be followed, and honestly I don't see it as any less coherent than the G1 TV series, or the movie (like what was the point of Ultra Magnus even existing other than to sell toys).  So yeah, it was a great 2 1/2 hour toy commercial, which is exactly what I expected.  Anyone recall the opening credits, the second credit was Hasbro.  That should sum things up right there.  Toy commercial - end of story.

[Ajax]

I wasn't going to say anything cause I thought I was alone, but I agree with Kommando. Went to see this movie with a couple friends and we enjoyed it. The movie probably shouldn't have been two and a half hours and it had it's flaws (ghettobots to name one), but that didn't detract too much from the fun. First of all, the old TF, Jetfire I believe, was greatness. Also, this movie had more TF fights in it then the first, which is what one goes to see. The first suffered from weird camera angles and quick cuts that made it impossible to get a sense of the action making it feel more like a disaster movie than giant robots fighting each other. Does it make sense that Optimus Prime was able to take Megatron and several other bots at the same time? Probably not. But it was a cool fight sequence that produced alot of memorable moments. When the movie ended the people in the theater (roughly thirty people were there since we went to the mid afternoon show) applauded. I don't believe in giving applause in theaters, it doesn't make sense, but that's me.

[BentonGrey]

I have to take the other route.  I saw it and enjoyed it.  I went with friends, we had a good time.  Sam's mother was probably the best character in the movie.  It had a story which could be followed, and honestly I don't see it as any less coherent than the G1 TV series, or the movie (like what was the point of Ultra Magnus even existing other than to sell toys).  So yeah, it was a great 2 1/2 hour toy commercial, which is exactly what I expected.  Anyone recall the opening credits, the second credit was Hasbro.  That should sum things up right there.  Toy commercial - end of story.

Hardly.  There is at least the possibility for something grander in the material:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transformers_(comics)#Dreamwave_Productions

The ideas are greater than their beginnings, but Bay has made them less.

[BWPS]

I didn't go in expecting much and I only wanted to see some awesome robot fights which in addition to Shia actually being funny is why the first movie was actually pretty damn good. In a three hour movie, I got to see one awesome robot fight (in trees), one mediocre fight (the beginning), one terrible fight (the end), about 150 terrible innuendo gags, and one funny joke (about that guy's shirt). It didn't deliver. I could make a 30 minute movie out of it that would have been pretty awesome although much less coherent but it doesn't make up for the rest.

[Kommando]

Hardly.  There is at least the possibility for something grander in the material:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transformers_(comics)#Dreamwave_Productions

The ideas are greater than their beginnings, but Bay has made them less.

I really would not expect to see any Dreamwave or G1 continuity from the movies, and yes I am familiar with the material and realize how good some of it is.  Even though I know it would never happen, it would be neat if the two franchises (GI Joe as well) would merge resulting in Golobulus being crushed by Optimus Prime's fist at some point, but it will never happen.  Not in the Bay-verse which has become a franchise on its own.  Only hope is that another company might want to explore that franchise in another series, with maybe a few nods to the moves (kind of like how Roughnecks was vastly superior to Starship Troopers and was more true to the source material).

[House Quake]

I've probably see more movies than most people because I never...ever... allows the opinions of others to prejudice my experience.

I am a believer that some movies... you just take them for what they are worth.  Judge them on thier own merits and avoid unfair comparisons.  I went to see Transformers 2 expecting a movie with a plot simple enough for young children to get... but with enough action to dazzle the other crowd.  And for the most part... it delivered.  Was it the Godfather..?  Hell no!  But I didn't expect it to be either. It was a decent and overall fun movie. It had short comings for certain.  But it was not the gawd awful terrible movie some are making it out to be.  

Why do movies like this make so much money..?  It the same reason why much of the crap music made now-a-days sell in the millions, while 'real' music barely gets recognized by the masses.  Its movies and music which caters to 'pop' culture.  Its simple and non cerebrial fun.  Most people don't go to the movies to analyze to death every aspect of every movie they see.  They just want to be entertained.

It just bothers me when people say they don't want to see a movie based on reviews and/or what some one else said about the movie.  I personally try to watch as many as I can, especially in certain genres and I make up my own mind in the end.  If its bad.. its bad.  But it won't be bad because I went in expecting the movie to be more than what it was... or because someone else said it was bad.

[BentonGrey]

HQ, these kinds of arguments always rub me the wrong way.  It posits a world in which we either have Shakespeare or neanderthal, frat boy-esq movies, with nothing in between.  No such dichotomy exists.  A movie can have tons of action, but still have a coherent plot.  It doesn't have to be cerebral to be good.  I can think of the new Bond movies, Iron Man, Hulk, or several other action packed blockbusters from the last few years.  They were all full of nice explosions, lots of action, and while they may not have had the depth of "Hamlet," they still had solid plots and compelling characters.  I'm not talking specifically about Transformers 2, since I haven't seen it, but I don't plan on seeing it because if HALF of what I've heard is true, I have no desire to fuel the machine that is turning out such dren with my money.  The only thing resembling a vote that I get about what kind of movies Hollywood makes is how I spend my money.  I'd rather not spend it until I know what I'm voting for.  

It's the B:TAS vs. Batman the Brave and the Bold debate all over again.  We get entertainment that is of a lesser quality because we settle for it.  If we were a bit more discerning in how we spent our money, then people like Micheal Bay wouldn't be making movies.

[Talavar]

First, a disclaimer - I don't care about Transformers.  I never have, and the fact that Transformers 2 is a Transformers movie is the first strike against it in my opinion. 

The problem with big summer movies sucking - and a lot of them suck - is that people go out to see these movies for the spectacle, and as if it's something that's expected of them (it's basically become a summer tradition, though it really only started in the 70s), and though they're willing to settle for bad summer movies (mainly by having reduced expectations), no one seems to love these movies.  No one loves X-Men Origins: Wolverine, Transformers 2, Spider-man 3, X-Men 3, Terminator Salvation, GI Joe (I'm predicting), etc.; but people are willing to settle for them and give them a pass because they have CGI, explosions and it's the summertime. 

It's actually not just limited to the summertime, but it definitely hits geek-friendly properties hard.  For many fans of these types of properties, it doesn't seem to matter that the movie studio process defecates all over the property in question - if it's at all up a geek's ally, he or she'll overlook massive deficits of quality.

And this is exactly the wrong way to be.  By reducing our expectations and settling for movies that range from garbage to mediocre, it just encourages the movie studios that quality isn't worth pursuing for these types of movies.  Because quality is hard. You've got to hire better writers, & take the time to go through improving drafts; you've got to hire good directors and actually let them have control of the movie; you've got to hire talented actors who may or may not be the current 'It' boy or girl.  The studios are willing to do this for prestige movies, ones chasing after Oscars in more than the special effects or sound editing categories, because the prestige means something to them, and those types of films tend to be cheap.  But if big summer movies are going to make dumptrucks full of money regardless of them sucking, and since these movies are already expensive to make due to their special effects & scale, the costs of quality aren't worth it to the movie studios.  It's an extra expense for no appreciable gain.

If people want to watch good summer movies - and I don't mean Hamlet here, but ones like Iron Man, the Dark Knight, the films Pixar makes, etc. - they have to show that quality matters to them in the only way that movie studios pay attention to, and that's by voting with their spending dollars.  If you actually enjoy Transformers 2 and think it's good (and I don't just mean good enough) by all means buy your movie tickets, the inevitable DVD release, the DVD or Blu-ray double-dip, etc.  But if you're settling for it because it's summer and a Transformers movie exists at all, save your money for something that you would actually want to encourage more of.

[Courtnall6]

Despite the horrible reviews I went and saw TF2 yesterday (like HQ I need to judge for myself). I'm a bigtime movie buff and I can honestly say TF2 is one of the worst films I've ever seen. I kinda liked the 1st movie after I realized that it wasn't a Transformers movie...but a movie about giant transforming robots. The 2nd film is just god-awful. The script seemed like it was written by a 13 year old boy...fart jokes, humping dogs, humping robot, "special" brownies, giant testicles, hot chicks everywhere, horrible dialogue and characterization, racial stereotypes galore, and a plethora of new autobots and decepticons who just show up without names and what they actually transfrom into. It was also too damn long. Action movies should not drag out for almost 3 hours. 2 hours max. Bay's Bad Boys II had the same problem (also not a good movie).

With all the so called "comedy" in this film...I laughed once...and it was at a scene where you weren't suppose to laugh at. The film is as also way too pro-war america. I kept expecting the screen to fill with Old Glory flapping in the wind and the standard "USA!" "USA!" chant to start.

Michael Bay is a one trick pony who's trick has gotten very lame. He has to have his obligitory shots in every movie. The low slow pan around the actors as they get out of a car or get up off the ground, upward angled shots of buildings/towers getting hit by whatever. He even rips off James Cameron's shots of a sinking Titanic for his sinking of an oil frieghter that the Decepticons attack.

Quite a painful experience to sit through. 1 out of 10 ( The 1 is for decent special fx...when you can figure out which giant robot is fighting which giant robot that is).

[thanoson]

Big screen movies and Radio Stations are not designed for the educated in general. They are designed for the others. That is why music sucks so bad nowadays. That is why the "Larry the Cable Guy" movies do so good. They're not for us, they're for them.

[Kommando]

Big screen movies and Radio Stations are not designed for the educated in general. They are designed for the others. That is why music sucks so bad nowadays. That is why the "Larry the Cable Guy" movies do so good. They're not for us, they're for them.

LOL well I can attest to that.  About three years ago I took three TVs to the dump as well as my radios and these days I can't be bothered to watch TV or listen to radio stations.  All my entertainment comes from online.

[Midnight]

Bay's Bad Boys II had the same problem (also not a good movie).

**** just got real...

[detourne_me]

I just watched Hot Fuzz again last night.  I suggest you all do the same.

[Jakew]

I just watched Hot Fuzz again last night.  I suggest you all do the same.

I watched it again recently too. I watched Terminator 4 soon after ... sure enough, a character was firing their gun in the air and going "aaaaaargh!" 

[catwhowalksbyhimself]

Interestingly enough, I just read that both stars of the movie in separate interviews stated that they have no clue what the movie is about or what actually happens.

That's a bad, bad sign.  Of course, it means less coming from Fox.  She may have looks, but judging by the things she's said in other interviews, that's about all she has going for her, but the guy, on the other hand. . .

[Sevenforce]

LeBouf? Pfft. I'd actually expect Megan to outFox him (ba dum dush)

Most people don't go to the movies to analyze to death every aspect of every movie they see.  They just want to be entertained.

And the bad thing about that attitude, is that it's BAD entertainment. It's like paying to see a pig fart for an hour and a half. If you knew thats all you'd be getting, would you still go? And if you did, still paying to see bad entertainment just encourages more bad entertainment, and you'll never get anything better - which, if someones deliberately paying for something so atrocious, they probably deserve

It just bothers me when people say they don't want to see a movie based on reviews and/or what some one else said about the movie.  I personally try to watch as many as I can, especially in certain genres and I make up my own mind in the end.  If its bad.. its bad. But it won't be bad because I went in expecting the movie to be more than what it was... or because someone else said it was bad.

The idea of reviews is exactly that, though. You don't want to waste time and/or money on something bad when you can just as easily go and spend it on something good, you need someone to give you an overview, hopefully an honest one. Not everybody has the money or the time to spend on watching every new thing in the cinema, and requires a...spoilering, of sorts, to decide on what can be pencilled in

Don't get me wrong, I completely agree that everyone should make their own opinions, but there just isn't enough time (there probably IS enough money ) to see and experience everything to do so, which means you have to budget them both.

[BlueBard]

I agree, Sevenforce.

I'm not going to be able to see every movie... and I frankly don't even want to see most of them.  I do depend on reviews and yes, word-of-mouth.

Based on the word-of-mouth I am getting from FR, it would be entirely reasonable for me to conclude that this movie would be worse than a waste of my time.  Not that I was going to go see it anyway.

[Jakew]

With all the so called "comedy" in this film...I laughed once...and it was at a scene where you weren't suppose to laugh at.

Which scene was that?

[Courtnall6]

With all the so called "comedy" in this film...I laughed once...and it was at a scene where you weren't suppose to laugh at.

Which scene was that?

When the US government liason shuts down N.E.S.T (Autobot and useless human Decepticon hunters) and proclaims that "This is our war now...and like every other war...we will win this one too!" (or something like that). It was such a lame line that I burst out laughing.

[House Quake]

If people want to watch good summer movies - and I don't mean Hamlet here, but ones like Iron Man, the Dark Knight, the films Pixar makes, etc. - they have to show that quality matters to them in the only way that movie studios pay attention to, and that's by voting with their spending dollars.

The public actually does speak volumes about what they enjoy vs. what they don't.  It just doesn't matter to the public what you or I would consider a good movie and what we don't. Do you realize just how many so called summer blockbusters fail...?  Most of them flop.  Very few succeed.  And they succeed not by catering to the cynical minority... but by trying to cater to the majority who simply wants to have be entertained.  Movie studios don't purposely spend millions on a 'bad' movie... but they will try to spend the money on movies they think would entertain.  The question is what do you consider entertaining?

[stumpy]

What the heck? One doesn't have to be part of a "cynical minority" to think many of the issues discussed about this movie are likely to make it crummy entertainment. And, I haven't really been hearing that the majority of moviegoers (cynical or otherwise) are raving about how entertaining they found it.

[BentonGrey]

If people want to watch good summer movies - and I don't mean Hamlet here, but ones like Iron Man, the Dark Knight, the films Pixar makes, etc. - they have to show that quality matters to them in the only way that movie studios pay attention to, and that's by voting with their spending dollars.

The public actually does speak volumes about what they enjoy vs. what they don't.  It just doesn't matter to the public what you or I would consider a good movie and what we don't. Do you realize just how many so called summer blockbusters fail...?  Most of them flop.  Very few succeed.  And they succeed not by catering to the cynical minority... but by trying to cater to the majority who simply wants to have be entertained.  Movie studios don't purposely spend millions on a 'bad' movie... but they will try to spend the money on movies they think would entertain.  The question is what do you consider entertaining?

If you keep pitching to the lowest common denominator in all facets of life, that number keeps sinking.  Don't get me wrong, we as a culture are getting precisely what we deserve.  That is a very sad fact, but a fact nonetheless.  That, however, is exactly why we shouldn't be wasting money on bad movies.

[thanoson]

Hmm.... the movie Idiocracy comes to mind for some reason.

[catwhowalksbyhimself]

The fact is, people are going to this movie because it's the sequel of a popular movie they liked the first one, so they go to the next one.  That doesn't mean the people going to this movie are actually going to like it, just that they will go to it because of the first one.  In fact, in past, some of the most profitably movies of a series were ones that moviegoers considered the worst one.

The real measure of what the average joe thinks of this movie is how well the next one does.

[Figure Fan]

Hmm.... the movie Idiocity comes to mind for some reason.

LOLOLOL

[BentonGrey]

Hmm.... the movie Idiocity comes to mind for some reason.

Idiocracy, you mean.  Yeah, I thought the same thing.

[thanoson]

Yeah, lack of sleep affects my spelling in general. Plus, I just happened to look at my dvd on the shelf. D'oh!

[UnfluffyBunny]

so either i'm reading incorrectly between the lines of posts in this thread, or i'm indirectly being called "uneducated" for enjoying this movie?

[Jakew]

The fact is, people are going to this movie because it's the sequel of a popular movie they liked the first one, so they go to the next one.  That doesn't mean the people going to this movie are actually going to like it, just that they will go to it because of the first one.  In fact, in past, some of the most profitably movies of a series were ones that moviegoers considered the worst one.

The real measure of what the average joe thinks of this movie is how well the next one does.

Agreed. The law of diminishing returns will prove out. Then again, there were THREE Pirates of the Caribbean films...