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Girl Genius thread

Started by Glitch Girl, October 18, 2010, 01:31:39 PM

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Glitch Girl

I know there are fans, so let's discuss...

Today's comic:
I vas wondering about him...

On the character in question (spoiler):
Spoiler
While I don't think Higgs is a typical Jager, he's certainly got some kind of physical link to them.  What, exactly, I don't know.  He's very old and knows the castle pretty well and remembers some of the older more "eccentric" inhabitants so... is it possible he's some kind of proto-jager?

BTW: have you guys seen the art reveal about Zeetha's dad?  It's outside the comic and the page is down now (durn) but there are refs in the wiki. 
-Glitch Girl

"Cynicism is not maturity, do not mistake the one for the other. If you truly cannot accept a story where someone does the right thing because it's the right thing to do, that says far more about who you are than these characters." - Greg Rucka

BlueBard

Higgs is definitely more than he seems to be, but the question of what and how remains to be seen.

I have a couple of theories:

Spoiler
1. A couple of times, it has been mentioned that the Heterodyne heir was male.  Agatha is obviously not male, though indisputably a Heterodyne.  It makes me wonder about why there's some confusion over this.  One possibility is that this was deliberate misinformation to throw enemies off the trail.  Another possibility is that there are really two Heterodyne heirs... and maybe Higgs is one of them, but not a spark.  I don't have anything other than sheer speculation to base that on.

2. We know that the Baron and Lucrezia had an affair.  Higgs' features do somewhat resemble the Baron...

One way or the other, I do suspect we'll find out how much more dangerous he really is.  Zola really picked the wrong crew to mess with, even if she is turning out to be more formidable than she first appeared to be.  If Zeetha survives, I suspect there will be a rematch some time down the road.
STO/CO: @bluegeek

Alaric

Glad to see this thread here, especially since I usually avoid forums dedicated to webcomics I read- usually too many people completely missing the point of the latest installment, or focusing entirely on the least interesting (to me) aspects...

Spoiler
Well, Higg's pronunciation of "was" certainly indicates a Jager connection. As for the gender of the Heterodyne heir, I've been wondering about that for a while. I suspect it may have something to do with Lucrezia's long-term plans requiring a female genetic child, but beyond that, there are several possibilities I can think of.

At this point, I'm wondering if
Spoiler
Zeetha is a) dead, b)dead, but revivable, or c) just very badly wounded. I'm hoping for b) or c)...
Fear the "A"!!!

Glitch Girl

#3
I'm hoping for "c" myself Alaric.  

Spoiler
The way Zeetha was taken out was almost embarrassing.  I'm going to blame it on happy-pollen dulling her to make myself feel better.  

I'm pretty sure she's not dead-dead because the revelation of her father Klaus hasn't been revealed in the comic, only in a leaked bit of artwork that I think has since gone "poof".  To have her dead and miss that reveal just doesn't make good narrative sense.

Viking... I mean BlueBard...
Spoiler
The only info we have on the male heir was he died young (though I can't remember if they said how young) and that this information is kept pretty hush-hush prior to everyone recently descending on the castle.  That being misinformation might be possible, but even so, I don't think Higgs is an heir - there's something inherently "servile" about him (his interaction with Tarvek earlier when the castle was running amok in the Muse's body if I recall correctly)  And remember, he is old enough to remember Igneous Heterodyne, who sounds like he predates the Heterodyne boys.

(like how the heck did I mis-attribute the comment like that?  Viking hadn't even posted yet?  Psychic flash?  nah.)



-Glitch Girl

"Cynicism is not maturity, do not mistake the one for the other. If you truly cannot accept a story where someone does the right thing because it's the right thing to do, that says far more about who you are than these characters." - Greg Rucka

Viking

I had not known there were any such art reveals about Zeetha's dad, GG.  Up until now, I had only ever accessed the website for the comic, and hadn't thought to look in other places for news and previews about Girl Genius.

And on the character in question (spoiler):

Spoiler

I love how his speech only betrays a slight smidgen of an accent.  I can almost envision a situation where the author says, "Aw, crud!  The guy inking the strip made a mistake on the lettering for a single lousy W, and now everybody thinks he's a freaking Jager!  Hey, wait... that's actually pretty cool.  I can work with that!"

Of course, as you note, plenty of background information is already set that screams that he is Jager-ish.  (Like that wonderful background briefing of the assorted injuries he sustained in carrying out his duties.)  I wonder if he's the Jager equivalent of covert ops, with strategic surgery to make him look more like an ordinary human.


daglob

Yeah, Viking, I kind of think that too. After all, Vole nor Jenka look less like "standard" Jaegers than anyone except the generals. In the GG newsgroup human/Jaeger hybrids have been considered. I wonder...

Plus, he healed up from massive trauma in just a couple of days.

Panther_Gunn

After today's strip, I *needed* a thread to converse in.

Spoiler
OMFG, he's a f-ing Jäger!?!!!  Totally didn't see that coming.  For the last few months, I'd been thinking he was the *real* Wulfenbach son, in seriously deep cover, and Gil was just some random (maybe not-so-random) spark he'd adopted early on.  But I think the jäger thing makes more sense now.
The Best There Is At What I Do......when I have the time.

Alaric

#7
Quote from: Glitch Girl on October 18, 2010, 05:13:53 PM
I'm hoping for "c" myself Alaric.  

Spoiler
The way Zeetha was taken out was almost embarrassing.  I'm going to blame it on happy-pollen dulling her to make myself feel better.  

I'm pretty sure she's not dead-dead because the revelation of her father Klaus hasn't been revealed in the comic, only in a leaked bit of artwork that I think has since gone "poof".  To have her dead and miss that reveal just doesn't make good narrative sense.

Viking...
Spoiler
The only info we have on the male heir was he died young (though I can't remember if they said how young) and that this information is kept pretty hush-hush prior to everyone recently descending on the castle.  That being misinformation might be possible, but even so, I don't think Higgs is an heir - there's something inherently "servile" about him (his interaction with Tarvek earlier when the castle was running amok in the Muse's body if I recall correctly)  And remember, he is old enough to remember Igneous Heterodyne, who sounds like he predates the Heterodyne boys.





Preferentially, I'm hoping for C, as well...

Spoiler
I get the feeling that revivification in the Girl Genius universe usually has... lasting side effects... Still, B would be better than A.

Spoiler
As for how she got taken out so quickly, I'd say the movit#11 had a lot to do with that- especially combined with the fact that Zeetha, good as she is, has shown a tendency to at times underestimate others... But, yeah, they're all still under the influence of the plants, as well.[/url]

I'm pretty sure you meant to address that last part to BlueBard, rather than Viking.

Have some more to say, but first, I think we need to establish some rules about spoilers. Can we assume that people reading this thread are already Girl Genius readers, and restrict the use of "spiler" tags to very recent things some people may not have had a chance to read yet, or should we continue "spoiler"-ing most of what we say?

Fear the "A"!!!

Glitch Girl

QuoteI'm pretty sure you meant to address that last part to BlueBard, rather than Viking.
Whoops!  Fixed.

As to spoilers, yeah I think anything older than a week or two should be considered spoiler-safe.  Sound good?
-Glitch Girl

"Cynicism is not maturity, do not mistake the one for the other. If you truly cannot accept a story where someone does the right thing because it's the right thing to do, that says far more about who you are than these characters." - Greg Rucka

BentonGrey

Fascinating stuff guys.  I really love this series, and I have to say, I haven't thought about the possibilities that y'all have mentioned.  I had been thinking that:

Spoiler
Higgs was one of the Heterodynes returned.  No one knows what happened to them.  He has always reminded me of the taller one...Bill?  Anyway, I imagine that is very unlikely, but the current hint of him being a Jaeger...I hadn't even considered it.  Awesome.
God Bless
"If God came down upon me and gave me a wish again, I'd wish to be like Aquaman, 'cause Aquaman can take the pain..." -Ballad of Aquaman
Check out mymods and blog!
https://bentongrey.wordpress.com/

daglob

Also, Zeetha shows up in a future episode. Perhaps a little Jaeger transfusion will help her.

BlueBard

GG, I'm looking at the strip you referenced and I think you might be reading too much into what Higgs said there.

He didn't say that he, personally, remembered Igneous Heterodyne.  He was simply reminding the Castle/Muse of an event that happened.  We don't really know how he knows this, but it's definitely more knowledge than a simple airship sailor ought to know.

What else do we know about Higgs?

- He is not a pilot or navigator, but was still able to set course for Mechanicsburg in an airship.
- He apparently survived an attack by DuPree while trying to save the Baron's life, twice, and managed to beat her.
- He sustained massive injuries while trying to get the Baron to safety.
- He is next seen at Mama Gnika's, where Gil was healed of serious injuries with Jager Battledrought.
- Gil drafts him into carrying 'The Hat'.
- He single-handedly defeats the Castle/Muse, while demonstrating some understanding of it's construction.
- The Castle/Muse recognizes Higgs somehow
- Higgs demonstrates some knowledge of the Castle layout, claiming he saw a map.
- Higgs and Zeetha start to bond, a little

I don't think he's a Jager.  It doesn't quite add up.  What it does add up to, I'm not sure.
STO/CO: @bluegeek

Glitch Girl

I don't think he's 100% Jager, but there are definitely Jagerishness in him.  According to this comic, a Heterodyne drank from the Dyne and got very Jager-like.  Later Vlad Heterodyne (I'm assuming the surname)  came up with the Jagerdraught and pretty much anything that got long term exposure to the Dyne started getting all tough and toothy. 

Also, some factoids from the author's 2008 San Diego Comics con panel. (at the end after the masquerade pics)
Quote4) When someone becomes a Jäger the only thing that changes about them is their appearance. They still have human genetics so when a Jäger reproduces, his offspring will be 100% human.

5) Ages! The generals are somewhere between 600-700 years old, Dimo is about 300, and Oggie and Maxim are around 250-300. Maxim is the youngest of the three. Phil has the exact ages written down somewhere but he couldn't remember off the top of his head.

7) Only the very best & strongest soldiers were chosen to become Jagers.
So if you survive the Jagerization, you can live a very long time, and if you were selected, you had already proved you were one of the  best, which could mean lots of training or if you survived the process, plenty of time to learn new things. 

-Glitch Girl

"Cynicism is not maturity, do not mistake the one for the other. If you truly cannot accept a story where someone does the right thing because it's the right thing to do, that says far more about who you are than these characters." - Greg Rucka

catwhowalksbyhimself

I missed that hint.  Interesting.
I am the cat that walks by himself, all ways are alike to me.

BlueBard

Pinky's gonna be black and blue by the time Higgs gets done with her...
STO/CO: @bluegeek

Glitch Girl

#15
Yeah, even though she got a hit on him, she's taking the worst of this fight.  At this point, I wouldn't be that surprised if the a) dies (especially when the Moveit wears off) or b) ends up with permanent damage.

I wonder how bad Higgs' wound is.

EDIT: Scratch that "dies" bit.  I forgot she's got a piece of the Other in her head.  We're probably not done with that plot point yet.

Now I wonder how many "Others" are out there.  We know of at least three I think, could there be more?
-Glitch Girl

"Cynicism is not maturity, do not mistake the one for the other. If you truly cannot accept a story where someone does the right thing because it's the right thing to do, that says far more about who you are than these characters." - Greg Rucka

Viking

Quote from: Glitch Girl on October 20, 2010, 01:45:55 PM
Now I wonder how many "Others" are out there.  We know of at least three I think, could there be more?

Well, if any of them wear dark suits and shades, and make a menacing reference to "Mr. Anderson," that would probably be a dead giveaway... Oh, wait.  I'm thinking of The Matrix movies.  But the Other's ability to replicate her consciousness in multiple entities is reminding me of Mr. Smith, for some odd reason.

In any event, I'm completely expecting (or at least fervently hoping) that Pinky survives with some severe humiliation.  Her usefulness as a plot point has not fully played out yet:

Spoiler
Since it's established that she's had the training to be able to seal away the Other's consciousness, and rifle through her memories on a whim, I suspect that could start a plot thread whereby Agatha could receive similar training.  Because I'm really ready for Agatha's battle of wills with her mother to finish up and move on.


Higgs' wound is nothing.  He's probably had worse from shaving.

Glitch Girl

Aaaaaannnd... we cut away from the action.  Argh.

You know, even though it's only been a few hours, maybe days for our heroes, it's been about three YEARS for us viewers since Agatha entered the castle.  Wow.
-Glitch Girl

"Cynicism is not maturity, do not mistake the one for the other. If you truly cannot accept a story where someone does the right thing because it's the right thing to do, that says far more about who you are than these characters." - Greg Rucka

BlueBard

Quote from: Glitch Girl on October 22, 2010, 01:01:17 PM
Aaaaaannnd... we cut away from the action.  Argh.

You know, even though it's only been a few hours, maybe days for our heroes, it's been about three YEARS for us viewers since Agatha entered the castle.  Wow.

You've got to admit, though... Team Foglio is keeping us hooked.
STO/CO: @bluegeek

Glitch Girl

#19
As of today, volume 11 begins.

"Nom nom..." heh heh heh.
-Glitch Girl

"Cynicism is not maturity, do not mistake the one for the other. If you truly cannot accept a story where someone does the right thing because it's the right thing to do, that says far more about who you are than these characters." - Greg Rucka

Viking

And hey, we're back to the action!

I also chuckled at the "Nom Nom" noises.  Do you think that iconic munching sound was originated by Cookie Monster, or does it go back farther than that?  Because truly, few things could make me smile like Cookie Monster's enthusiastic "OMM NOMM NOMM NOMM!!!" noises.

Uncle Yuan

I'd considered Higgs to be a sophisticated construct like Punch and Judy or Von Pinn, but the Jagersomething hypothesis has some merit.

So Agatha and Lola have the Other, who/what/where is the third?
"But there's no use crying over every mistake
You just keep on trying 'till you run out of cake
And the science gets done, and you make a neat gun
For the people who are still alive."

daglob

When Von Pinn gets mad she gets Jaegerteeth; perhaps there is a variation of the Jaegerbrau given to some constructs (or built in) that makes them look fairly innocuous most of the time. But if they get angry, well, to paraphrase someone, you wouldn't like them when they're angry.

Head of the Intelligence Division sounds better and better all the time.

Glitch Girl

Quote from: Uncle Yuan on October 26, 2010, 04:31:51 AM
So Agatha and Zola have the Other, who/what/where is the third?
She was downloaded into Anvenka by Tarvek way back here.
-Glitch Girl

"Cynicism is not maturity, do not mistake the one for the other. If you truly cannot accept a story where someone does the right thing because it's the right thing to do, that says far more about who you are than these characters." - Greg Rucka

Viking

Quote from: Uncle Yuan on October 26, 2010, 04:31:51 AM
I'd considered Higgs to be a sophisticated construct like Punch and Judy or Von Pinn, but the Jagersomething hypothesis has some merit.

So Agatha and Lola have the Other, who/what/where is the third?

Prince Tarvek of Sturmhalten had a robotic "sister," whose consciousness was replaced with that of the Other.  Being a robotic construct, she also outfitted her vocal projectors to be able to mimic Agatha Heterodyne's voice, which prompts a Pavlovian-like obedience in most of the populace of Sturmhalten.

Eh.  GG responded more succinctly and quickly than I could.

Glitch Girl

Today's strip... Ouch?

Spoiler
I'm really not sure how to read this.  It could either be "Oh yeah, I just took a horrible wound, I should be showing signs I'm in pain, right?" or "Okay, I've never met anyone who could hurt me this bad, this is a new experience. I may be in trouble".    Thoughts?

Sorry Viking.  Timing is everything.  :)
-Glitch Girl

"Cynicism is not maturity, do not mistake the one for the other. If you truly cannot accept a story where someone does the right thing because it's the right thing to do, that says far more about who you are than these characters." - Greg Rucka

BlueBard

My guess is ...

Spoiler
that Zola is going to put Higgs down (as in unconscious and severely wounded) after taking a good deal of abuse herself.  If anybody on Agatha's side dies here, my bet is on Violetta.  I think she's next on Zola's dance card, as the players work to delay Zola long enough for Agatha to reach the Castle library and try to restore the Castle's consciousness.

Beyond that, there are so many threads hanging that it's hard to say what will happen next.  Gil and Tarvek will want to stop Zola, of course, and Zola's fixation on Gil should give him an edge.  Don't forget that Othar Trygvassen is still loose in the Castle somewhere and may put in an appearance.  On top of that, the Baron is likely to attack the Castle soon.
STO/CO: @bluegeek

daglob

Please remember that he is The Unstoppable Higgs.

BlueBard

Quote from: daglob on October 27, 2010, 03:19:06 PM
Please remember that he is The Unstoppable Higgs.

I remember he had to be patched up the last time he took this much abuse.  Impalement will ruin most people's day.  Not that he won't recover, but he's not going to be the one who takes Zola down.
STO/CO: @bluegeek

Viking

I dunno... I have a growing feeling that Higgs is this universe's equivalent of Chuck Norris.

Higgs does not take damage from being impaled by a sword.  The sword takes damage from impaling Higgs.  And then probably apologizes afterwards.

The only way Higgs could possibly be more unstoppable would be if he had a beard, so that one could joke: There is no chin behind Higgs' beard.  There is only another fist.