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Author Topic: Spiders, Goblins, and Devils, Oh My!  (Read 4589 times)

Offline BentonGrey

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Re: Spiders, Goblins, and Devils, Oh My!
« Reply #30 on: February 28, 2015, 05:36:45 AM »
Thanks guys!

So, does anyone have a HF for Malekith the Accursed?

How about classic Nova?
« Last Edit: February 28, 2015, 05:44:00 AM by BentonGrey »
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Offline spydermann93

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Re: Spiders, Goblins, and Devils, Oh My!
« Reply #31 on: February 28, 2015, 05:54:51 AM »
Jim is our local Nova expert, I'd say. His hero files should be pretty darn accurate when it comes to Nova.

As for Malekith, I used to have him, but I wasn't quite happy with him. I think Jim might have Malekith, as well.

EDIT: One fun thing that you could do is have Malekith summon packs of wolves. He's a hound-master, if I remember correctly.
« Last Edit: February 28, 2015, 05:58:06 AM by spydermann93 »

Offline hoss20

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Re: Spiders, Goblins, and Devils, Oh My!
« Reply #32 on: February 28, 2015, 07:34:00 AM »
Benton, I went ahead and sent you what I have worked out for Malekith.

Offline Jimaras8

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Re: Spiders, Goblins, and Devils, Oh My!
« Reply #33 on: February 28, 2015, 08:29:32 AM »
Benton, I went ahead and sent you what I have worked out for Malekith.

Spyder i think your Malekith hf is fine, i added a couple of powers for diversity like a mist teleporting power but i think it's really good overall. I like the wolf summoning idea, it really fits the character.

Benton as for Nova if you have downloaded my latest batch of hero files there is a Nova Prime and a Nova Centurion there. I assume you are looking for the 70 era Nova who only had a portion of Nova Force. If Nova centurion doesn't suit too i could cook up a 70 Nova since he is one of favourite characters.

Offline BentonGrey

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Re: Spiders, Goblins, and Devils, Oh My!
« Reply #34 on: February 28, 2015, 06:58:13 PM »
Thanks guys!  Jim, yes, a 70s flavor Nova would be very helpful!

On a related note, does anyone have a good set of HFs for Annihilius and Blaastar?

How about Batroc?  Do any of y'all have anything clever to make him a threat for Cap?
« Last Edit: February 28, 2015, 07:09:48 PM by BentonGrey »
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Offline Jimaras8

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Re: Spiders, Goblins, and Devils, Oh My!
« Reply #35 on: February 28, 2015, 09:27:52 PM »
I will see if i can make the hf tomorrow, two days top Benton. I have nothing on Blastaar or Annhilus although i wanted to do both some time  :P.

As for Batroc i am afriad he is quite limited. Yes he can pose a threat to Cap but i suppose his savate cofines him a bit. His kicks should powerful and to mkae him competent i would add high stun chance since he can hit neural spots on his opponent. He is quite skilled in his style so he will be able to dish some damage. Oh Benton which Nova mesh or skin do you plan on using for Nova. it would be helpful if i made the hf with the mesh you are going to use.

Offline BentonGrey

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Re: Spiders, Goblins, and Devils, Oh My!
« Reply #36 on: March 01, 2015, 01:38:50 AM »
Cool, thanks Jim.  There's no hurry.  I'm taking on a big chunk of characters that are going to keep me busy for a while. 

I'm going to use Nova69, methinks, as the skin for that one is perfect for classic Nova.

I may have to do some key editing for Batroc, methinks.
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Offline BentonGrey

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Re: Spiders, Goblins, and Devils, Oh My!
« Reply #37 on: March 06, 2015, 02:08:52 AM »
New question gents, and a big one.  Just how invulnerable should Galactus be?  We've got competing imperatives with this question, as we want to be accurate but also want him to be playable in the game.  Thus, even though he could probably shrug off just about anyone's attacks when he isn't starving, I'm thinking that a proper FF build will make him a force that can be taken down by enough combined attacks.  What do y'all think?

My instinct is Ephemeral + energy siphoning attacks and 50 Inv.
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Offline spydermann93

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Re: Spiders, Goblins, and Devils, Oh My!
« Reply #38 on: March 06, 2015, 04:53:58 AM »
Well, this is a really interesting question.

What "type" of Galactus are you looking for? One that requires a lot of heroes, both big and small, working together to wear him down, or one that needs to be faced with a team of heavy-hitters, like Silver Surfer, Thor, Hulk, and (perhaps) Gladiator (don't know why he would be helping; Lilandra order the Guard to help, perhaps?) ?

Or perhaps a combination?  Like, you could have a team of heavy hitters (perhaps AI controlled) fighting against him, head-on, while a player-controlled team of "weaker" heroes runs around the map, trying to complete objectives to make him weaker.  It really depends on how you want him to be included, in-game.

If you're looking for a straight-up fight against him, I think that the combo that you're thinking of could work (some AI changes would need to be made so that he isn't killing himself).  I prefer to give my more powerful characters the Concrete material type with a decent level of invulnerability.  That way, players can't just keep stunning him over and over (of course, you could just give him Iron Jaw) and a solid blow against him at low health won't mean instant death (he's at 50 hp, and a player hits him for 51, the invulnerability won't be counted).

I'll need to put more thought into this, to make sure that the Big G isn't a pushover like he tends to be in the comics. :P

Offline hoss20

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Re: Spiders, Goblins, and Devils, Oh My!
« Reply #39 on: March 06, 2015, 07:10:36 AM »
I also build my heroes with the Concrete material type. Of course, the Big G also has almost impenetrable Passive Defenses on top of Concrete and one of the Invulnerable attributes. I think I'll throw him against the Heralds that I have (Airwalker, Destroyer, Fallen One, Firelord, Morg, Nova II, Redshift, Silver Surfer, Stardust, and Terrax) or maybe a select group from among these ten. I also may throw together a group of the most powerful Avengers or go back and find the group of heroes that fought Galactus in his weakened state way back in Fantastic Four #243 by John Byrne (I just really liked that issue).

Instead of Ephemeral, what about Energy Tanks or the vanilla Metabolic? Energy Tanks gives him a fixed amount that he can regenerate, but in order to fill his tanks, he needs to use an Energy Leech or Absorb Energy power. With Metabolic, you can customize what he gains a bonus/penalty with based on his Energy level. You could probably go with the Power Damage or Energized option.

Edit: I went ahead and found the roster that battled Galactus in that FF issue:

Dr. Strange

Fantastic Four
Human Torch
Invisible Woman
Mr. Fantastic
Thing

Avengers
Captain America
Iron Man
Thor
Wasp

This group doesn't really stand a chance against a full powered Galactus.

Offline BentonGrey

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Re: Spiders, Goblins, and Devils, Oh My!
« Reply #40 on: March 07, 2015, 05:24:19 AM »
Gents, I'm not entirely sure what I want to do with the Big "G," but I want him to be fun for a big RR bout.  I may also design a mission where the player controls Galactus and his Heralds vs....well, pretty much everyone else. 

Thanks for the thoughts.  You've got me thinking as well.  Here's what I've got so far:

First, do we think it would be appropriate for someone like Reed Richards, Beast, or other geniuses to be able to 'spot a weakness' on Galactus.  In other words, if we use concrete or another type of material that provides resistances, those resistances can be reversed with Genetic Damage attacks.  I may have to start giving more of my powerhouses concrete for just that purpose.  I'm not sure it works for Galactus, though.  He seems like he should be beyond that.  What do y'all think?

The other option is Invulnerability + Physical Resistance.  I'm going to do some testing soon, and I'll see how that shapes up against a full Avengers team.

I do like the idea of Metabolic with some penalties.  I'll mess around with that as well.

I'm working on a multi-attribute for him.  See what y'all think of what I've got so far: combines cosmic awareness, metabolic strength, transmutator, immortal, shake it off, level headed, disciplined, and unbeliever.

Galactus has often displayed abilities that might be categorized as telekinetic.  Do y'all think that might be a good fit as well?
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Offline hoss20

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Re: Spiders, Goblins, and Devils, Oh My!
« Reply #41 on: March 07, 2015, 10:26:12 AM »
I made an alteration to the Power Cosmic attribute that comes with FFX. I created a Power Cosmic (Lesser) and Power Cosmic (Greater). I use these, in conjunction with other attributes, for all of my Heralds and the Big Guy himself.

Power Cosmic (Lesser)
Cosmic Awareness
Flier
Fast Flier
Invulnerable (5)
Power Reserve

Power Cosmic (Greater)
Cosmic Awareness
Flier
Fast Flier
Invulnerable (10)
Power Reserve
Transmutator

I've given my Galactus the following attributes:
Disciplined
Level Headed
Power Cosmic (Greater)
Strange Visitor (this is necessary due to the fact that the Concrete material type doesn't offer resistance against Energy)
Super TK

I've also given him a Body Armor Passive Defense and an additional, more powerful Passive Defense for resistance against Heat, Cold, Acid, and Radiation. As mentioned somewhere else, I try to go by the old Marvel Superheroes Role Playing game. The stats come from the late 80's and early 90's, which is almost the perfect time in comics for us, Benton.

I know we probably build our heroes differently, but I didn't know if seeing mine might at least give you a different way of looking at him. He's definitely one of those guys who probably just needs his own attribute that no other character could utilize.


Offline BentonGrey

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Re: Spiders, Goblins, and Devils, Oh My!
« Reply #42 on: March 07, 2015, 06:53:27 PM »
Hoss, I always welcome seeing how other folks adapt characters!  it's definitely helpful, and it looks like you've got some good ideas. 

Body armor is a good idea for gameplay purposes, as he can be worn down.  Perhaps I could do a combination of invulnerability and passive energy shield, so that it costs him to defend as well as attack. 

I've done some testing with my custom attribute, plus Ephemeral, Ponderous, Inv. 50, and different energy systems.  I've tried both Energy Tanks and Battery Powered.

Energy Tanks seemed to work best, as the Battery Powered just gave him too much easily available energy, and he wiped out everything in no time.

I put him up against the whole Avengers roster and the Fantastic Four, and with the 50 Inv., they were actually able to threaten him a bit when they worked together, but most of them were little more than annoyances, as they should be. In the end, they didn't come close to taking him.  When I played as the Avengers heavy hitters, though, they kept the Big G stun locked and annihilated him. 

I think Spyder is right; the key is going to be good AI.

I do like the influence of Ephemeral.  Galactus is driven by his hunger, and energy is his most precious resources.  This creates a way for the players to beat him over the long run.

The next step is probably for me to finish my Heralds and throw them against him.
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Offline spydermann93

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Re: Spiders, Goblins, and Devils, Oh My!
« Reply #43 on: March 07, 2015, 07:02:13 PM »
If he keeps getting stun locked, I'd recommend Grim Resolve + a Material type, if you haven't already.

Concrete + Grim Resolve helps a lot against stuns. A slight passive defense might also work, if you're so inclined to have that on top of everything that he already has.

I would suggest Iron Jaw, but since he's Immortal, that attribute won't work. If you took Immortal off of him, then yeah, you can definitely go for Iron Jaw, instead.

As for Body Armor, I think that Hoss was saying that he gave Galactus two passive defenses, one called Body Armor and another called something else.  I don't think that he was talking about the "Body Armor" attribute.

Offline hoss20

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Re: Spiders, Goblins, and Devils, Oh My!
« Reply #44 on: March 07, 2015, 11:10:36 PM »
Thanks for clearing that up for me, Spyder. I named my Passive Defense, "Body Armor" and it stuck in my head while typing my response.

Now that it's brought up, though, utilizing Body Armor in some capacity may not be a bad idea. Check out the FFX Manual. It gives an example of a character having both an Invulnerable attribute along with Body Armor.  I know that you want to have Galactus' resistance to being damaged somehow linked to being weakened by his attackers or his energy level. This way, for example, you could start him with Invulnerable (20)or (30) along with Body Armor (20). Eventually, the Body Armor will be worn down, but he will still have some Invulnerability left. He is Galactus, after all.

Wait! How about using Energy Shield (Passive) or Body Aura, the more powerful variant? Damage taken is split between Health and Energy. Since you may be going with some version of Metabolic, whose effectiveness is tied to Energy levels; this might work nicely for what you want to accomplish. Of course, a lower than 50 grade Invulnerable attribute may still be necessary. I know you were concerned with Battery Powered giving him too much Energy, but maybe you could give him that plus Energy Shield (Passive) and not even bother with an Invulnerable attribute, maybe just Physical Resistance or Concrete material to up his resistance. I had also thought about Energy Tanks instead of battery Powered due to the fact that, although he would start with a ton of energy, he would have to use some sort of Energy Absorption power to gain his full energy. This also might work well with Energy Shield. I guess take a look at the FFX Manual to make sure I've accurately described these things.

Okay, I've rambled long enough. I think I'm probably making things more complicated rather than helping.  :wacko:
« Last Edit: March 08, 2015, 01:50:14 AM by hoss20 »

Offline spydermann93

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Re: Spiders, Goblins, and Devils, Oh My!
« Reply #45 on: March 07, 2015, 11:28:25 PM »
Does Energy Tanks work with Battery Powered?

I thought that Battery Powered negated all energy gain from Energy Leech, so you couldn't get passed the 50% mark that Energy Tanks puts you at.

Or am I just wrong?

Offline hoss20

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Re: Spiders, Goblins, and Devils, Oh My!
« Reply #46 on: March 08, 2015, 01:49:27 AM »
I think you can only use one or the other. I'm sorry if my suggestion implied using them both. I meant to suggest going with either one depending on how you wanted to build Galactus. I'll edit my post to avoid confusion.

Offline spydermann93

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Re: Spiders, Goblins, and Devils, Oh My!
« Reply #47 on: March 08, 2015, 01:55:33 AM »
If you want to get really goofy with Galactus, I revived an old attribute called "Solar Stores", which grants four times the energy! :D

Offline hoss20

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Re: Spiders, Goblins, and Devils, Oh My!
« Reply #48 on: March 08, 2015, 03:46:10 AM »
Well, this is essentially what Energy Tanks does, doesn't it? I know the big difference is that Energy Tanks only allows energy regeneration up to 100% (as opposed to the 400% the character starts with), unless the character absorbs energy. If you choose the Ambient option, which allows energy absorption from ambient sources, then the character can potentially regenerate all the way back to full. The manual states that this allows the character to "slowly regenerate Energy Points past 100," but I don't know what the meaning of "slowly" is in this case.

Plus, I think Benton wants to somehow inhibit Galactus' energy stores in some fashion in order to have a chance of him weakening enough for the heroes to do something against him. Just giving him four times the Energy with his normal energy regeneration rate is just going to make him that much more difficult to stop.
« Last Edit: March 08, 2015, 03:49:41 AM by hoss20 »

Offline spydermann93

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Re: Spiders, Goblins, and Devils, Oh My!
« Reply #49 on: March 08, 2015, 04:08:13 AM »
Well, this is essentially what Energy Tanks does, doesn't it? I know the big difference is that Energy Tanks only allows energy regeneration up to 100% (as opposed to the 400% the character starts with), unless the character absorbs energy. If you choose the Ambient option, which allows energy absorption from ambient sources, then the character can potentially regenerate all the way back to full. The manual states that this allows the character to "slowly regenerate Energy Points past 100," but I don't know what the meaning of "slowly" is in this case.

Plus, I think Benton wants to somehow inhibit Galactus' energy stores in some fashion in order to have a chance of him weakening enough for the heroes to do something against him. Just giving him four times the Energy with his normal energy regeneration rate is just going to make him that much more difficult to stop.

Essentially, yes, that's what Solar Stores is, but without needing to absorb any extra energy.

I was basically just goofing around with that suggestion, really.  It would make him ridiculously powerful, seeing how much he's going to be tied to his energy levels. :P

I'm all for the Energy Tanks with Energy Siphoning and Metabolic.  I think that could provide some really dynamic and engaging battles with Big G.

Offline mac402

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Re: Spiders, Goblins, and Devils, Oh My!
« Reply #50 on: March 08, 2015, 11:28:08 AM »
I gave Galactus a ton of HPs and Invulnerability (75), also a passive defence that absorbed 100% of all energy attacks (Defender attribute), an Energy Shield (Passive) and Battery Powered. That makes him pretty much the strongest character there is aside from abstracts like Eternity, The Living Tribunal etc. Then I gave him Metabolic Strength and used one of the feedback attributes Dependency with range of 1 (so it only considers Galactus himself) and an effect Loose Invulnerability when below 50% of energy (that condition type had to be added to the script file iirc). The result was very satisfacting, it reflects the whole "how well fed Galactus is" argument used in comic book vs threads. It is quite useless to attack him at full power even with the best heavy hitters and a good tactic against him is to survive long enough to force Galactus to expend a lot of his energy so he gets weaker and can actually be damaged and beaten. A Grim Resolve attribute and in my case Energy material takes good care of stun attacks. Galactus has both energy draining and life draining attacks that he can use to replenish himself so how tough he will be depends a lot on fine tuning the AI. His other attributes include Super TK, Transmutator, Group Teleporter, Cosmic Awarness, Immortal, Mindless, Flier, Ponderous and Focus. With the Enchanter attribute he can bestow a custom attribute Power Cosmic similar to what Hoss20 uses. And for offense he has a 360 degree melee crushing attack, an explosive energy projectile (amped by Focus attribute) and a summon swap that can create his Punisher Robots. He also can power null or energize other characters, teleport and restore others to full HP. As I said the end result was very satisfactory.

Offline Scorpion13mk2

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Re: Spiders, Goblins, and Devils, Oh My!
« Reply #51 on: March 21, 2015, 02:08:43 PM »
You know, when I made Galactus in my games, I gave him a grenade attack that dealt acid burn at a low level to represent something I remembered from an old What If issue where he fought the Avengers and I called it "Pesticide". It pretty much behaves the way it sounds.

Offline BentonGrey

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Re: Spiders, Goblins, and Devils, Oh My!
« Reply #52 on: July 12, 2015, 05:50:04 PM »
Ha, Scorpion, I remember that, 'cosmic bug spray,' yeah.  Good idea!

I haven't finished with Galactus yet, but I'll be coming back to him.

Thanks for all the ideas and feedback guys, you've all been tremendously helpful!

Here's what I'm working on currently:

-What kinds of minions would Baron Mordo summon?
God Bless
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Offline Cyber Burn

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Re: Spiders, Goblins, and Devils, Oh My!
« Reply #53 on: July 12, 2015, 06:05:59 PM »
Here's what I'm working on currently:

-What kinds of minions would Baron Mordo summon?

Unfortunately, my only exposure to "Baron Mordo" was the old "Spider-Man" Cartoon where he had Humans under his control.

Offline WyldFyre

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Re: Spiders, Goblins, and Devils, Oh My!
« Reply #54 on: July 13, 2015, 05:39:13 AM »
To the best of my recollection Mordo used other magic using humans against the good Dr.  However, being a sorcerer, he should be able to summon at least minor spirits and demons to torment our heroes. Maybe not the "Hoary Hosts of Hoggoth", but some kind of nether-worldly beings.

Offline hoss20

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Re: Spiders, Goblins, and Devils, Oh My!
« Reply #55 on: July 13, 2015, 06:12:35 PM »
I have my Baron Mordo summoning a few thingies, but I definitely have Demons of Denak in there.

Offline BentonGrey

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Re: Spiders, Goblins, and Devils, Oh My!
« Reply #56 on: August 12, 2015, 04:24:57 PM »
Thanks for the responses guys! 

Hoss, what are you using for said Demons, and how do they shape up in game?

Alright guys, here is another question:

I'm working on Apocalypse now, and I'm having some trouble.  I've never come across him in the comics, as my X-Men reading only took me through the early 80s.  I only know him from the 'toon, and while that show is excellent, I'm worried it may have given me a skewed perspective on the big A.  In the show, the X-Men never manage to be more than an annoyance to Apocalypse.  They basically bother him until he leaves on his own accord.  Is he really so powerful that an X Team shouldn't be able to dent him, or is that more a plot contrivance?
God Bless
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Offline spydermann93

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Re: Spiders, Goblins, and Devils, Oh My!
« Reply #57 on: August 12, 2015, 05:06:49 PM »
Apocalypse should make the X-Men work very hard for their victory.  The guy is capable of going up against the likes of Thor and the Hulk with only moderate trouble.  He can augment his strength to immeasurable levels, he is a genius (especially when it comes to Genetics and Engineering), and he has very powerful telepathic and telekinetic abilities, as well as shape-shifting.  Think Martian Manhunter if he was more concerned about taking over the world, minus the intangibility and weakness to fire.  He was even strong enough to withstand Black Bolt's sonic screams, and that's saying a lot.

In game, he should be very adaptive to his situation, always having an answer to whatever the X-Men could throw at him, but he should not be unbeatable.  And should he ever be in trouble, he can always call upon his Horsemen :P


Offline BentonGrey

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Re: Spiders, Goblins, and Devils, Oh My!
« Reply #58 on: August 12, 2015, 05:43:16 PM »
Thanks Spyder!

Hmm, I wonder if the adaptable attribute might be applicable to him.
God Bless
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Offline BentonGrey

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Re: Spiders, Goblins, and Devils, Oh My!
« Reply #59 on: August 12, 2015, 11:37:38 PM »
Alright gents, I've been working on Apocalypse this afternoon, and I'd definitely like some feedback.  Thanks to Jim for doing the heavy lifting and giving me a great herofile to start with!

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Apocalypse has a custom attribute called Molecular Control that grants him: INVULNERABLE (05), FAST HEALING, DISCIPLINED, MASS CONTROL, IMMORTAL, and PHYSICAL RESISTANCE.)

I had to make some sacrifices in terms of powers because of the number limit, but on the whole, I think I'm pretty happy with him.

What do y'all think?
God Bless
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