Star Trek Discovery

Started by HarryTrotter, April 06, 2017, 12:50:28 PM

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HarryTrotter

#30
The episode (and this is clearly one pilot episode split into two) wasnt the problem.Airing half of it was.But thats a problem with the buisness model and not the story.
SS was just naming examples.You could add every superhero movie and tv-series.See my numerous rants about originitis. :)
If you think about it,it was a bit like the DS9 pilot.It detailed Siskos life,explained Bajor and the wormhole and all that.
Okay,its an odd choice not to actually future the ship Discovery.But its not something that kills the series right away.Again,its too early to judge.
''Even our origin stories have gone sour.''
Jon Farmer

Silver Shocker

I actually did think of the DS9 pilot myself. I didn't make a point to mention it because while all things HT just pointed out are true of it, it does introduce your entire main cast and make it clear who they are and what their role in the show will be going forward. You meet Kira, Bashir, Odo, Quark, and the rest. The pilot of Enterprise is also comparable.

Cat, I did mention that not everyone who watches the show will read interviews and the like. And I do agree with you that it shouldn't be required reading. That's something I've complained about many times over in the comics forum. All I meant to convey is that the intent of the creators is have the focus on a younger, less experienced officer and see them rise through the ranks and develop, and they have put that premise out there as a form of promotion. This is a departure from what's come before. All previous Star Trek TV series (and all the original timeline movies, for that matter) have had the central character as the one in charge. Sisco was in command of DS9, and all other shows starred the captain of the ship. This is going for something, actually, almost like Kirk in the first JJ. Abram flick (which again, would be an origin story), but here it's a character we've never met. I do think that's intentional to some degree. I would imagine CBS/Paramount would like to get fans of both the modern movies and the older series on board.
"Now you know what you're worth? Then go out and get what you're worth, but you gotta be willing to take the hits. And not pointing fingers, saying you're not where you want to be because of him, or her, or anybody. Cowards do that, and THAT AIN'T YOU. YOU'RE BETTER THAN THAT!"
~Rocky Balboa

detourne_me

so...wow.  episode 3 was unlike any other Trek show I've ever seen.

Shogunn2517

Well, if anyone's interested in a rather objective opinion, I am familiar with ST, definitely not a fan, but I didn't think the show was half bad.  I hear the complaints about the format and potentially wasting two full meaningless episodes. I get that.  But the way I see it, most shows(less nowadays) typically fill seasons with random meaningless episodes that don't really advance plot anyway.  This did.  It may be majorily disconnected from the rest of the series but it was a fun start.  Enough to give us a "lay of the land" for non-fans.  A good enough hook.

As far as comparisons to The Orville, and it out trekking Star Trek, I suppose that could make sense for NOW.  I dont see that lasting.  How you gonna have a show with "discovery" in the title named after a exploration vessel and it not be about exploring and adventuring in fantastic locales?  Even still, if I were a fan I'd be interested in the advancement of the story. Or to see themes and characters I enjoy.  Like having a Star Wars movie about someone not named Luke. Or an X-Men series about some mutant kids.  I'd be fine with that as long as it seemed familiar to me.  From where I sit and my rather scant ST knowledge I think it does.

HarryTrotter

Interesting episode.Shades of Alien.
Somebody has to say it,so- Stamets is gay,right?
''Even our origin stories have gone sour.''
Jon Farmer

detourne_me

Quote from: HarryTrotter on October 03, 2017, 06:09:45 PM
Interesting episode.Shades of Alien.
Somebody has to say it,so- Stamets is gay,right?
I'd think so. Anthony Rapp is out and I'd see him wanting his character to be gay as well.

catwhowalksbyhimself

Quote from: HarryTrotter on October 03, 2017, 06:09:45 PM
Interesting episode.Shades of Alien.
Somebody has to say it,so- Stamets is gay,right?

One of the characters is, so probably that's the one.
I am the cat that walks by himself, all ways are alike to me.

HarryTrotter

The spore-drive thing just raises too many questions.  :wacko:
''Even our origin stories have gone sour.''
Jon Farmer

Deaths Jester

They bought it at Pod People R Us...
Avatar picture originally a Brom painting entitled Marionette.

Silver Shocker

i said it earlier in the thread, I'd heard that after the pilot they started doing wacky sci-fi monster of the week stuff like they often saw in the older Star Trek shows, and they certainly did, but with a healthy dose of "look what we can do" in the special effects department. So now instead of TOS trying to test how many times they can try to take glittering vapor and a blanket that looks like it's made out of pizza and make them scary, now we've got Lockjaw's grotesque cousin, who reminds me quite a bit of the redesigned demons from Doom 3.
"Now you know what you're worth? Then go out and get what you're worth, but you gotta be willing to take the hits. And not pointing fingers, saying you're not where you want to be because of him, or her, or anybody. Cowards do that, and THAT AIN'T YOU. YOU'RE BETTER THAN THAT!"
~Rocky Balboa

HarryTrotter

Was that Lance Reddick as a Vulcan admiral?
Spore drive plot plays out exactly as you expected.Also,the can say sh*t and f*ck now.
Spoiler
Oh,and leaving Mudd behind
is still kind of a dick move.
''Even our origin stories have gone sour.''
Jon Farmer

HarryTrotter

Well,the interest seems to have died out here.
We are nearly at the mid-season finale,and all in all,its not terrible-terrible,its just so bloody generic.Like this was a script for something else,but mid-development somebody decided to slap a Star Trek logo on it.Its all a balancing game where you try to wage good and the bad points of every episode.So far,it breaks even in most cases.But thats it,more or less.
''Even our origin stories have gone sour.''
Jon Farmer

Silver Shocker

Of the various shows I watch week-to-week, Discovery, sadly, is one of the ones that doesn't hold my interest very well. Like, I'll be doing something else while it's one, and I'll remember certain scenes, and of course, make sure to pay attention whenever Klingons are on screen since they speak almost entirely in subtitles that go by pretty fast, but week-to-week if you asked me what actually happened in an episode there's a good chance I'd only kinda be able to describe it. Like for example, for me this is the episode that homages the TOS episode where Spock gets high on space spores but only sorta-kinda.  It's a shame, because I do want to give the show to chance, but I've rewatched literally every past Star Trek series in the past few years (most of them this past summer on Netflix; I just recently got back into rewatching DS9, which is still a lot of fun) and I find this show lacks a lot of the fun and levity of past Treks. I keep thinking at times it feels like the rebooted Battlestar Galactica then Star Trek.

They have said they'll be a season 2 (which doesn't terribly surprise me) so maybe they'll pull an Enterprise and do some adjustment for feedback. Or maybe not. Only time will tell.
"Now you know what you're worth? Then go out and get what you're worth, but you gotta be willing to take the hits. And not pointing fingers, saying you're not where you want to be because of him, or her, or anybody. Cowards do that, and THAT AIN'T YOU. YOU'RE BETTER THAN THAT!"
~Rocky Balboa

catwhowalksbyhimself

I noticed that pretty all the gushing reviews about how it's the best Star Trek ever amount to "It's better because it's nothing like Star Trek."

Still, it seems to be pretty popular among new audiences, so it might be here to stay.
I am the cat that walks by himself, all ways are alike to me.

HarryTrotter

Everyone and their brother have said this doesnt feel like Star Trek...and I tend to agree.Its a generic SF series.Watchable,but rarely engaging.
''Even our origin stories have gone sour.''
Jon Farmer

Silver Shocker

Quote from: catwhowalksbyhimself on November 08, 2017, 01:45:02 AM
I noticed that pretty all the gushing reviews about how it's the best Star Trek ever amount to "It's better because it's nothing like Star Trek."

Still, it seems to be pretty popular among new audiences, so it might be here to stay.

Not sure about the "best Star Trek ever" part, is that hyperbole or there actually reviewers claiming that? In any case, based on what you've said here, it really sounds like it's a case of "Maybe you just don't like Star Trek all that much."

Mind you, this is literally the first time I've ever even thought of "how does it rank alongside the other Star Treks?" And to honest, while I don't dislike the show, I'd have to put it around the same spot as Enterprise. Again, the problem is a lack of personality, levity and variety. All the other Star Trek shows were capable of doing very goofy comedic episodes as well as very serious minded ones (albeit some with a level of camp, but that's part of the fun). I mean, no better example of that quality lacking here than the character of Harry Mudd. I mean, yeah, he's kinda the same character, except Discovery Mudd is bitter and cynical and vindictive, whereas TOS Mudd is very jolly and over the top and hammy. I keep thinking to myself how bizarre it is that these are supposed to be the same character. By comparison, I've never had that problem with Spock, Or Kirk, Or Sarek, or any of the other characters that appeared in a much later Trek series. And unlike the new versions of characters in the rebooted series, this is supposed to actually be the same guy, BEFORE he met Kirk. The ending of his latest appearance made that abundantly clear. Are we supposed to be believe he's sometime become MORE carefree in ten years, even after an unhappy marriage?
It's just such a bizarre disconnect.

And that's without even mentioning the Klingons in this series. Poor Worf's really going to get some raised eyebrows from his crewmates when they see them!
"Now you know what you're worth? Then go out and get what you're worth, but you gotta be willing to take the hits. And not pointing fingers, saying you're not where you want to be because of him, or her, or anybody. Cowards do that, and THAT AIN'T YOU. YOU'RE BETTER THAN THAT!"
~Rocky Balboa

daglob

Quote from: Silver Shocker on November 11, 2017, 09:19:59 AM
And that's without even mentioning the Klingons in this series. Poor Worf's really going to get some raised eyebrows from his crewmates when they see them!

" We do not speak discuss it with outsiders."

catwhowalksbyhimself

Quote from: Silver Shocker on November 11, 2017, 09:19:59 AM
Not sure about the "best Star Trek ever" part, is that hyperbole or there actually reviewers claiming that? In any case, based on what you've said here, it really sounds like it's a case of "Maybe you just don't like Star Trek all that much."


I have literally seen more than one reviewer make that claim.  The one that stands out gushed over the new captain being a cold heart psychopath.  That was that reviewer way of discribing him, not mine.
I am the cat that walks by himself, all ways are alike to me.

HarryTrotter

Hes not really wrong about the last part.
''Even our origin stories have gone sour.''
Jon Farmer

Silver Shocker

Quote from: catwhowalksbyhimself on November 11, 2017, 03:35:24 PM
Quote from: Silver Shocker on November 11, 2017, 09:19:59 AM
Not sure about the "best Star Trek ever" part, is that hyperbole or there actually reviewers claiming that? In any case, based on what you've said here, it really sounds like it's a case of "Maybe you just don't like Star Trek all that much."


I have literally seen more than one reviewer make that claim.  The one that stands out gushed over the new captain being a cold heart psychopath.  That was that reviewer way of discribing him, not mine.

That's a strange thing to praise in a Star Trek series. They realize this isn't the Mirror Universe right? (One assumes...?)

Actually, Captain Lorca is probably the main reason why I compared it to the rebooted Battlestar Galactica.
"Now you know what you're worth? Then go out and get what you're worth, but you gotta be willing to take the hits. And not pointing fingers, saying you're not where you want to be because of him, or her, or anybody. Cowards do that, and THAT AIN'T YOU. YOU'RE BETTER THAN THAT!"
~Rocky Balboa

HarryTrotter

The last episode hints at different universes,so there might be something there.
It ends on an odd note,I must say.
''Even our origin stories have gone sour.''
Jon Farmer

Silver Shocker

#51
Just had to resurrect this thread to say...

Anyone see the newest Short Trek? The one with the Tribbles. I have to say....What. The Crap. That was the goofiest thing Trek has ever put in the shows or movies. Yep, even goofier than the comedy episodes in DS9 and Voyager. Goofier than Our Man Bashir, Captain Proton, any of the Vic Fontaine episodes, goofier than Star Trek 4 (or 5, for that matter), this one tops 'em all head and shoulders. It feels like it's half-way inspired by The Office and half-way inspired by Rick & Morty, features humor and dialogue unlike anything I've ever seen or heard in Trek, and I have to assume a not-insignificant portion of the fanbase is going to/already does flipping HATE it.

Me, personally? I've never actually decided whether I like the Tribble episodes to begin with, but one thing's for sure, they're definitely memorable, and this one is no exception.
"Now you know what you're worth? Then go out and get what you're worth, but you gotta be willing to take the hits. And not pointing fingers, saying you're not where you want to be because of him, or her, or anybody. Cowards do that, and THAT AIN'T YOU. YOU'RE BETTER THAN THAT!"
~Rocky Balboa