Not a bad start to the new season.  Not bad at all.  Some thoughts, in no particular order, organization, or significance.

[spoiler]
Matt's sort of adopted Molly, and he's back on the police force and made detective.  It's nice to see him picking his life back up, but I was surprised to hear about that divorce.  It just doesn't seem to connect with last season that well.

Mohinder as a double agent.  Nice.

The new character Maya.  Someone with a more negative ability, further explained in the comics as a plague-like ability.  Certainly makes life interesting.

Our first duplicate power, which the writers hinted last season that we'd be seeing soon--another flier.  Apparently the super-powered boyfriend for Claire they've been talking about.

Am I the only one who thinks that Hiro may end up dong the things usually attributed to Takensi?  Maybe not, but we'll see.

Now we know how many members the older hero group had.  12, with 8 left now.  And a misterious new figure that killed Hiro's dad.  I like how Ando's continued as the faithful assistant, serving Hiro's dad and earning his trust.  Of course, one has to wonder what he's going to do now.  And what will happen to that legacy that Hiro was supposed to be given upon his return.
[/spoiler]

All in all, very promising.  I'm glad that they focused on just a few characters for now in stead of trying to get them all in the first episode, although they did hit most of them, some more briefly than others.

Also, [spoiler]where did Peter get his new electrical zapping ability?[/spoiler]

Yeah, the wife and I were enthralled from the start!  Good episode and a promising start.

In response to some of your things Cat:

[spoiler]Yeah, I felt the same way.  They seemed to be picking up the pieces well, and it definitely seemed like they loved each other...I don't really get the divorce either. 

Yeah, I loved that.

I'm vaguely hoping there's more to this kid than just a duplicate power.

Yeah, I was thinking that the whole time....although, I am beginning to suspect that it's going to be more of a Mr. Peabody situation...does anyone else remember that show?  The one where the dog and the boy 'fixed' history?

I'm really disappointed that we didn't get to see Sulu's power, or Mrs. Petrelli's for that matter.[/spoiler]

On another note:

[spoiler]Yay, Peter's back!  Next to Hiro, he's my favorite character.[/spoiler]

I can explain cat's second spoiler, but it contains spoilers for something that won't happen for a few episodes, so don't read if you don't want to know - You HAVE been warned:

[spoiler]Kristen Bell, who played the title character on Veronica Mars, is going to be joining the show and her character is supposedly going to have some sort of electrical powers. She's supposed to show up sometime in the middle to late part of next of month. And there's supposed to be flashbacks or something that eventually reveal what happened during the 4 and a half months between the first season ender and second season opener, so.......[/spoiler]

A slow start to the season but a good one.

-MJB

Like Cat, I've got some thoughts from this first episode and thoughts others might like to share their thoughts about my thoughts.

[spoiler]
Who are the other members of the older hero group, and do we already know some of them?  Hiro's father clearly recognized his attacked, suggesting he was one of the members of the group, but wouldn't it be interesting if instead he was an old villain of the group come to get revenge?

Could Molly's nightmares about the man worse than the boogeyman be triggered by proximity? IE: Maybe the man worse than the boogeyman is the same person who attacked Hiro's father and him being in NYC is triggering Molly's nightmares.

Does Maya's brother have a power, and if so what is it?  Perhaps simply an immunity to Maya's plague-like power?

West seems really shady to me, could he be a plant from The Company?  We haven't seen any interaction between him and any of the other students at the school, so maybe he's "new" too. 

What's up with Nathan?  Did he resign his congressional seat upon his brother's "death?"  And how exactly did he survive?  And can he no longer afford shaving cream and a razor?

What was Peter doing in the shipping crate?  Is he working for Microsoft now and trying to help their Zune gain marketshare by destroying a shipment of iPods?  I hope so.
[/spoiler]

And on a slightly different note:

[spoiler]
I did read a few weeks ago that Kristen Bell's character was supposed to have some connection to Peter's "death" and his absence for 4 months, so it'll be good to see how that all ties together.  And I'm glad they cast her on the show, Veronica Mars being canceled was the biggest travesty since Arrested Development getting canceled.
[/spoiler]

Ah, Heroes.... how I have missed thee.

[spoiler]Loved the scenes where Claire's Dad was dealing with life at his new job, and finally snapped in the face of his overbearing manager.  As for Claire, her high school really seems to be giving off a Sunnydale vibe... I half expect her to start staking vampires in the next couple of episodes.

I'm guessing that Maya's power is to be able to carry and release diseases (not that hard to guess), and that her brother's power relates to keeping her power in check.  Possibly the ability to neutralize other heroes' powers as well?  We'll see.
[/spoiler]

from the votepetrelli.com website:

Quote from: Nathan Petrelli
    My fellow New Yorkers, it's been a long and hard journey to the top of the mountain, and I thoroughly appreciate everything you have given me and have done for my family and I. This state is the archetype of this country, and has allowed for more opportunity than I ever thought imaginable. Winning the election on November 2nd was a thrill that I will never forget, nor would I want to. It's something that will remain with me, even as I make the following statement.

    In all the decisions I have made in my public life, I have always tried to do what was best for New York and its citizens. Recently I have encountered a situation that renders me unable to put the best interest of New York as my number one concern. Without going further into further details, I am resigning from my elected seat as Junior Senator of New York state, effective immediately.

    This was never my intention, and I want all of you to know that my desire to do the right thing for the people of New York, the same quality that won my election, is the same desire and urge I have right now. Please do not worry about me or my family, while there are extenuating circumstances to explain my abrupt change of heart, but I do not wish to delve deeply into any of my reasons as they are personal, and in these hard times, privacy is important for my family.

    Nathan Petrelli 

Guess that answers that.

I heard a theory on another board about Peter in the crate. let's spoiler this:
[spoiler] Part 1: Peter had mimicked both halves of Niki/Jessica. Niki's strength and Jessica's ability to jump bodies.
Part 2: As Peter is carried skyward by Nathan, his soul jumps into Nathan's body.
Part 3: Peter's body explodes, then regenerates much later.
Part 4: The peter in the crate is a Hollow, like Green Arrow in Quiver. His soul is elsewhere, which explains his amnesia
However, this doesn't explain why he has the haitian's necklace or is handcuffed to the inside of the crate.[/spoiler]

I managed to catch the show online in the morning.  It was pretty good, but it didn't grab me as much as the others.  Maybe that was just that I watched it right after I had gotten up, when I was pretty tired.

[spoiler]
They're doing a much better job of connecting everyone to the storyline this season.  The only ones not involved are Peter and Hiro, and their actions could easily turn out to be connected later on.

HRG is as awesome as ever.  Is there anyone who has worked as a clerk of some kind and not wanted to do that?

Kensei is also pretty cool.  I had heard that Kensei was going to be a white guy and was concerned about it, but they pulled it off in a way that made sense, didn't break continuinity, and wasn't racist at all.  Good job, Heroes writers.  I love when Hiro was telling him all the things he did in the stories, and Kensei just punched him and said "All I need to do is get a drink."

Matt's storyline was a bit jarring.  The divorce pretty much came out of nowhere.  Still, it does get rid of Janice, and she sometimes dragged his story down last season.  I like Molly's storyline, too.

Claire's storyline was alright.  I'm not too fond of frying boy, though.  His "robot or alien" joke was a little annoying, and the whole "using his power to spy on Claire" thing was just creepy.  Hopefully that last one was the intention of the writers.  He also looks a bit too old, like he should be in college, though that's pretty good considering the actor is 27.  I'm very glad that they're showing duplicate powers, though.  That should be done a lot more in superhero stories.
[/spoiler]

Interesting start to the season...

[spoiler]

I think it's interesting that arguably the two most popular characters, Peter & Hiro, are the ones not immediately attached to the main storyline; it's better that it's them, since they're compelling enough on their own to still make you interested in what is otherwise a tangent.

Hiro in Medieval Japan is either going to end up doing the things that Kensei is famous for, or at least getting him to do them; one of those temporal paradoxes Star Trek loves to have.

When they found Peter in the cargo bin and he shot something, was it electricity or radiation?  My immediate thought was radiation, a little bolt of Ted's power, but I could be mistaken.

There are any number of reasons Peter could have no memory at this point, from the cliched bump on the head, to the Haitian getting overzealous. 

[/spoiler]

About Maya:

[spoiler]
Last week's comic introduced her and said that she created a plague, or plague-like effect which infected those around here.  Her brother could very well be a power canceler.  That would be interesting.

The comic also quoted Suresh's book, which both were reading, saying that a negative evolution can often find it's place as something good, which is why they are trying to find him for help.  That hints that Maya may end up finding some way or changing or using the ability in a less destructive manner.

Her showing up, however, could make Mohinder's double agent thing very difficult, especially if the Company decides she's too dangerous to be left alive.  Then he's be forced to choose between keeping his cover, and breaking it to save here.  I think there's at least a decent chance that's what will happen.
[/spoiler]

As for what Hiro has to do with the main story:

[spoiler]
I'm betting Takensi is one of the 12 first generation heroes.  His power has already been stated to be immortality, so he'd still be around.  In fact, he very well may have joined the group recognizing Hiro's last name.
[/spoiler]

[spoiler]

Quote from: ips on September 25, 2007, 01:07:26 PM
regarding claire's new friend...

i'm not 100% positive obviously, but i suspect he's telekinetic and not just capable of flying. if he can just fly... well the odds are probably that he's her long lost brother. groan.

<snip>

i don't think the power is flight. i think it's telekinesis. i think they realize that more than one flying character is useless down the road if they want to use it... and since they barely used it with Sylar last season, it's fair game and still fresh. It makes the character more versatile obviously... that's my bet.

First of all, telekinesis was hardly barely used last season.   Heroes Wiki lists 34 examples.  Flight, by contrast, was used only 10 times, 2 of which were in the online comics.  Flight would be far more fresh.  There's also a new comic out featuring him, where he talks at great lengths about how cool flying is and never once mentions moving things with his mind.  But really, there isn't any evidence at all for anything besides flight, so I'm going to go with Occam's razor and say that's all he can do.

This certainly doesn't mean he has to be related to Nathan.  Everything we've seen so far indicates that what powers the parents have has absolutely nothing to do with what particular power the child gets.
[/spoiler]

My bit, I guess

[spoiler]I realize this will probably come up later in the series, but I'm curious about one thing... How did Nathan get healed, regardless of whether it was an actual healing or it's an illusion? As far as I can remember, both people (Linderman and the Illusion girl whose name I don't remember) capable of those powers got knocked off.[/spoiler]

Mostly though, I like what I've seen, but for right now I'm patient enough to see how it all plays out.

Quote from: ips on September 25, 2007, 02:33:16 PM
regarding telekinesis... maybe it was used 34 times but it was almost always used to cut open someone's head of those 34 times. there were other instances of course, and they were great but not by a lead hero character. so we've never had the opportunity to explore those powers as a viewer. also, in your snippet you cast aside the most compelling reasons that the power would be more than simple flight. it's just another useless character if it's only flight (again). not to mention they already have one useless flying character as part of the main hero lineup.

keep in mind the comics are not necessarily canon. the only thing determined from last season was that the comics are written to at least work within the continuity established, or about to be established, by the show. besides, him talking about how great flying is doesn't mean that's all he can do. it just means that's all he's discussed so far in that comic book. - but like you said, it could go either way.

Of the 34 times telekinesis examples (keep in mind that in several cases, many uses are listed in the same example) cutting someone's head open accounted for only 5 of them.  And Peter used it a few times; he's certainly a main hero character.

I wouldn't consider flight useless.  It saved the world last season, remember?  And it's certainly very good at escaping from people or getting somewhere fast.  Besides, who says that frying boy is going to participate in any sort of conflict, anyway?

[spoiler]

Quote from: Tomato on September 25, 2007, 02:49:02 PM
I realize this will probably come up later in the series, but I'm curious about one thing... How did Nathan get healed, regardless of whether it was an actual healing or it's an illusion? As far as I can remember, both people (Linderman and the Illusion girl whose name I don't remember) capable of those powers got knocked off.

First of all, Candice certainly isn't dead.  She may have been knocked out, but she was still able to use her powers to disguise herself.  If she was killed, she would have revealed her true form (an overweight teenage girl according to the comics).  Second, who says that Nathan got healed?  It's quite possible that he wasn't harmed by the explosion at all.
[/spoiler]

ips

[spoiler]

Quotei'm going to call this one way early. should be interesting to see... but the writers often employ a bait and switch tactic with the characters. at least they did last season. so the writers will push maya and use her as patter to distract the audience and resolve her story arc and when they do it will launch her brother's story arc which is the true main focus of the South American siblings' story arc. so my hunch is that maya metabolizes a plague and her brother metabolizes a vaccine... and his vaccine is what cures the hero disease suresh's sister died from and molly is ailing from.

Except that the actress for Maya has been signed on as a main cast member, and the one for her brother has not.  She was also one of the first new characters to be mentioned as one of the main ones.  In no account has the brother ever even been mentioned before.  The doesn't mean he won't end up being very important, but she is the main character, and he is the guest, make of that what you will.
[/spoiler]

Still enjoying the series a bit, that's a good start.

Not related to the latest episode, but Luke Ski published his parody song.

Holding Out For Hiro - lyrics, downloads, and bad puns away.

I suspect that both Maya and her brother will be around most of the season if not all of it.  Remember there were several characters last season who were as much "guest stars"/"reoccurring characters" as main characters.  D.L., and Angela Petrelli all both guest stars whose characters were reocurring initially to the show.  I believe there were more too, including Ando.  Several of these characters were upgraded to regular characters and stars.  However, a few still are considered "guests" or "reoccurring" characters.

[spoiler]  Yeah, the haitian wiping Peter's mind makes sense.  I'm guessing the company came in and decided to keep him alive or the haitian himself decided to keep Peter alive.  Wiping his memory does effectively take back a bunch of his powers, as he has to think of the person who has the power in order to use it, at least as far as he understands it.  Using the electricity may disprove that though, but in using other powers like his brother's flying, he might not be able to use it if he can't remember Nathan. 

Second, Matt's divorce somewhat makes sense.  He and his wife's marriage was rocky at best, and it seemed like they might have been fooling themselves at the end.  Or something else has come up like Matt is impotent and the baby isn't his.  I do like the Matt, Mohinder, Noah connection.  Also, would anyone else not mind if DL and Nikki never appeared in the series again?  I mean, their story was pretty lackluster last season, and the ends seemed pretty tied up at season's end.  Although for some reason I love the idea of Molly and Micah(?), because my mind just goes with the future of the heroes, seeing them being the future leaders of the heroes community.[/spoiler]

About Peter

[spoiler]
Why does the Hatian have to have anything to do with it?  The necklace may indicate that, but it may not.

I mean, the guy exploded, for goodness sake.  If anything could shock someone enough to induce amnesia, that would be it.

Besides, it as been established that the Hatian works for Mrs. Petrelli, and the Company considers him a rogue now and an enemy.  If he had something to do with it, Mrs. Petrelli would likely know something about it.

Or not.  I guess we'll see.
[/spoiler]

Quote from: Conduit on September 25, 2007, 03:10:35 PM
[spoiler]

Quote from: Tomato on September 25, 2007, 02:49:02 PM
I realize this will probably come up later in the series, but I'm curious about one thing... How did Nathan get healed, regardless of whether it was an actual healing or it's an illusion? As far as I can remember, both people (Linderman and the Illusion girl whose name I don't remember) capable of those powers got knocked off.

First of all, Candice certainly isn't dead.  She may have been knocked out, but she was still able to use her powers to disguise herself.  If she was killed, she would have revealed her true form (an overweight teenage girl according to the comics).  Second, who says that Nathan got healed?  It's quite possible that he wasn't harmed by the explosion at all.
[/spoiler]

[spoiler]Ummm... did you not see his face in the mirror of the bar? I kind of doubt he was psyching himself out had the blast not hurt him at all. I get your point about Candice, but I have a hard time believing she'd go out of her way to help Nathan with a permanent illusion after he botched Linderman's plan up so bad.[/spoiler]

[spoiler]

Quote from: Tomato on September 25, 2007, 08:38:51 PM
Ummm... did you not see his face in the mirror of the bar? I kind of doubt he was psyching himself out had the blast not hurt him at all. I get your point about Candice, but I have a hard time believing she'd go out of her way to help Nathan with a permanent illusion after he botched Linderman's plan up so bad.

That could have just been a hallucination.  I've looked at the reflection again, and virtually all the skin on his face is burned off.  If he had been that badly burnt, I doubt he would have survived to this point.
[/spoiler]

Is it possible that:

[spoiler]
Candace's power has grown to the point where she can create permanent illusions that stick around whether she's nearby or even consciously supporting them.  That would explain how her illusion kept after she got knocked out. (I doubt she's dead, especially as the writers mentioned more being revealed about her)

We already have seen that people in the company are not always following the same person.  Perhaps Candace, like The Hatian, follows Mrs. Petrelli, rather than Linderman.  Nathan's current appearance could just be an illusion, and being away of it, Nathan occasionally can see through it.

As for the extensive scarring, people really have lives through stuff just as bad. . .

Besides, even if he dropped Peter in the air and flew at supersonic speeds, there's no way he wouldn't get caught in at least some of the blast, which it seems to be has happened.
[/spoiler]

And about Nathan and his "useless" power

[spoiler]
Is Nathan's power really useless because it is by it's very nature, or because he doesn't use it?

Think about it, all last season, Nathan absolutely refused to use his powers, and even pretended that he didn't have them, unless actually forced to use them.  Even so far this season, he seems to not be using them at all.

The new kid, on the other hand, seems to use them quite causually.  Perhaps they are trying to redeem that particular power.  Superspeed flight is not that bad of a power, really, not if used right, but Nathan never used it.

We may find it a whole lot cooler by the end of the season.
[/spoiler]

Quote from: catwhowalksbyhimself on September 26, 2007, 07:38:25 AM
Is it possible that:

[spoiler]
Candace's power has grown to the point where she can create permanent illusions that stick around whether she's nearby or even consciously supporting them.  That would explain how her illusion kept after she got knocked out. (I doubt she's dead, especially as the writers mentioned more being revealed about her)

We already have seen that people in the company are not always following the same person.  Perhaps Candace, like The Hatian, follows Mrs. Petrelli, rather than Linderman.  Nathan's current appearance could just be an illusion, and being away of it, Nathan occasionally can see through it.

As for the extensive scarring, people really have lives through stuff just as bad. . .

Besides, even if he dropped Peter in the air and flew at supersonic speeds, there's no way he wouldn't get caught in at least some of the blast, which it seems to be has happened.
[/spoiler]

And about Nathan and his "useless" power

[spoiler]
Is Nathan's power really useless because it is by it's very nature, or because he doesn't use it?

Think about it, all last season, Nathan absolutely refused to use his powers, and even pretended that he didn't have them, unless actually forced to use them.  Even so far this season, he seems to not be using them at all.

The new kid, on the other hand, seems to use them quite causually.  Perhaps they are trying to redeem that particular power.  Superspeed flight is not that bad of a power, really, not if used right, but Nathan never used it.

We may find it a whole lot cooler by the end of the season.
[/spoiler]

On the flying, exactly.  For example, if someone flew around in a a circle fast enough, they could create a big whirlwind.  Or, if someone flew forward at a high speed, that would would make him/her a human battering ram.

I'll be curious to see what the producers do with the power of flight on this show.  My interpretation of the first season was that with only flight as a power, finding uses for it could be difficult.

Not being any physically tougher or stronger than an ordinary human, trying to be a flying battering ram could result in as much damage to the flier as to the target.

I also have images of somebody flying fast enough to create a whirlwind... and then getting caught in the uncontrollable wind currents.

[spoiler]This issue of flight is interesting to me. I think flight would be a cool power because of its uses purely as transportation. If, as depicted last season, Nathan not just flies, but flies at very high speeds (something we haven't seen of West), then that makes him very useful. In real life, I would rather be able to do that than to do something like liquefy solid objects. (Actually, they would both be pretty cool, but flight is very practical.) Meanwhile, a power isn't at all useless just because it isn't a combat power or doesn't look cool on camera. I would be very happy if they found an interesting way for Nathan to be able to advance the plot, as he often did last season, whether or not it involves him being shown flying all the time.

I tend to assume that Candace's illusions are neither mental illusions nor simple light illusions that she has to concentrate to maintain. If they were mental (meaning that she tricks the victim's brain into seeing light that isn't there) then it wouldn't make sense that people she hadn't yet used the power on would see them. In other words her form (and anything else she "illusioned") would differ for everyone who looked upon her unless she affected them. And, realistically, in today's world, you can only go on so long before someone notices that the picture they have of you on a cell phone or in the security camera isn't what's standing in front of them. She would seem to need some sort of persistent illusion power to do what she does. Of course, if that were the case, we don't know the illusions would necessarily go away if she were incapacitated or even dead.

I don't know exactly what happened to Nathan regarding his wounds, but if he was burned over half of his body the way they depicted on his face (and there is every reason to believe he would have been) then he would not survive without supernatural help, like a Linderman-like character could provide. He would need constant hospital care and isolation just to keep from getting infections.

BTW, if he really is scarred like that and his unscarred visage is some sort of persistent light illusion, then why did he see through it when he looked in the mirror? I have a sinking feeling that it's going to turn out that he is covered by an illusion but they decided to give us that "reveal" because it is so dramatic, even if it isn't terribly realistic. Of course, one answer was that both illusion and hallucination were at play in that scene. What everyone sees could be an illusion and what Nathan saw was actually his hallucination of what was really below the illusion, something brought on by his anxiety about what he knows is there...

BTW, since when is Claire smart? I mean, I know all she was shown doing in the classroom scene was knowing something that most people probably know anyway, but I worry they will try to retrofit her into some sort of brainy character mold, which I don't think is consistent with what we have seen so far.
[/spoiler]

[spoiler]
Or maybe the burns that Nathan saw in the mirror are just a hallucination.  After all, he did look confused by them, and they weren't there when he looked at them again.  Maybe it's some sort of future premonition, maybe it's some sort of psychological attack sent by a bad guy (perhaps the guy Molly keeps seeing), but really I can't see how it could be real in any way.

And by the way, in the episode Five Years Gone, Sylar was able to use Candice's power to fool cameras.

QuoteBTW, since when is Claire smart? I mean, I know all she was shown doing in the classroom scene was knowing something that most people probably know anyway, but I worry they will try to retrofit her into some sort of brainy character mold, which I don't think is consistent with what we have seen so far.

Since when is she stupid?  The impression I got from Season 1 is that she's a pretty average student as far as grades are concerned.  All she did was get one question right, and I doubt they'll show her schoolwork much.
[/spoiler]

[spoiler]Nathan's visage could be the result of his character being put through the whole split personality because of trauma thing that was driving the Nikki/Jessica plot last season[/spoiler]

[spoiler]i just think its odd that West drove to school if he could fly.  if i was 17 and could fly. i sure as heck wouldn't be driving.  that ups the creep factor quite a bit in my books.[/spoiler]

[spoiler]

Quote from: detourne_me on September 26, 2007, 03:11:35 PM
i just think its odd that West drove to school if he could fly.  if i was 17 and could fly. i sure as heck wouldn't be driving.  that ups the creep factor quite a bit in my books.

He probably doesn't want people to wonder how he gets to school everyday.  From the comic, he obviously doesn't want people to know that he can fly, even if he isn't careful at all about keeping the secret.
[/spoiler]