Colossus vs Thing...could Petey beat Ben?

[SingleMalt]

This would be an interesting fight. Has this ever happen in Marvel?

[lugaru]

Between Ben and the hulk ben was not as strong but a better fighter, still he cant beat the hulk.

I think Colossus is a better fighter than Ben but that's not enough to beat him.

[GhostMachine]

I think Ben would win. The Thing is more of a straight up brawler, while Colossus seems to have some actual hand to hand combat training, but lets not forget that the Thing also trained as a professional wrestler after he eventually returned to Earth following Secret Wars so he can probably use some throws and takedowns if necessary and he definitely has the experience advantage over Colossus.

[Uncle Yuan]

From what I can remember from the Marvel Universe, they have a very comparable strength and invulnerability level.  If this is true, then as the others have indicated, Thing has the advantage in expereince and training.

But where the real difference is, is in their attitude about fighting.  Petey has always been a bit of a "gentle giant," artist's soul and yada yada.  Ben is a scrapper - there are few things in this world that get his blood pumping like a good brawl.  Attitude + skill make a very strong advantage when all else is equal.

[daglob]

I did a version of Stan Lee for FF1 (I had the skin, so why not). I decided to give him the ability to summon three of his co-creations (acknowleding the contributions of Jack Kirby and Steve Ditko). So, which three to pick? I chose Spider-Man as an overall scientist/martial artist/gadgeteer/intelligence, the Human Torch as air support and artillery, and The Thing as muscle/armor cav.

Ben is not as strong as Thor, The Hulk, The Abomination, and maybe a few others (haven't looked in my Handbook to the Marvel Universe lately), but he is tough, intelligent, a savvy combatant, has YEARS of experience from street brawling to (probably) unarmed combat training in the military, then he's had to fight all sorts of cocamamie menaces since he became The Thing (not to mention a sequence I didn't read about Ben being in some kind of infinite-level fighting circuit). As an all-around fighter, Ben is probably only outclassed by Captain America and a VERY few others.
Petey wouldn't be a pushover, but I believe Ben would eventually take him.

And the only way to stop Ben is to kill him.

[Sword]

In one of the earliest FF stories, Ben punched through battleship steel. It did take him a while, but I'm fairly certain that organic steel is weaker than battleship steel.

[ow_tiobe_sb]

If Kitty Pryde is around, my money is on Mr. Grimm:

[spoiler]






--Uncanny X-Men Annual #5 (1981)
[/spoiler]

Remember: There is usually a Kitty involved when great men fall.  ^_^

ow_tiobe_sb
Phantom Bunburyist and The Prat in the Hat

[GrizzlyBearTalon]

What issue is that from? That was hilarious.

[zuludelta]

I could have sworn I read an old comic book that had Colossus beating the Thing. I always thought the Thing got shafted by a lot of writers, it seems like everytime they need to show how tough some guy or new Fantastic Four foe is, they have that character beat the Thing as a demonstration of their power.

[Verfall]

I could have sworn I read an old comic book that had Colossus beating the Thing. I always thought the Thing got shafted by a lot of writers, it seems like everytime they need to show how tough some guy or new Fantastic Four foe is, they have that character beat the Thing as a demonstration of their power.

Same thing can be said for Juggernaut and Colossus and pretty much every other "bruiser" in the Marvel universe. It's really a slap in the face to the brawlers out there.

[stumpy]

If Kitty Pryde is around, my money is on Mr. Grimm:

[spoiler]






--Uncanny X-Men Annual #5 (1981)
[/spoiler]

Nice find! I'm sure she's had costumes that were more revealing, but Kitty's dress looks pretty scanty, being slit the way it is.

BTW, I wonder who won the arm wrestling match between Reed and Sue in the first panel?  :P


[edit]Almost forgot my main point...[/edit]

FWIW, there was an Amazing Spider Man annual panel someone posted a while back by Mark Guenwald and Bob Layton with the strong characters broken down into the following categories:

• Super-Heavyweights Hulk, Thor, Hercules, Wonder Man, etc.
  
• Heavyweights Thing, Sub-Mariner, Sasquatch, etc
  
• Super-Mediumweights She-Hulk, Luke Cage, Colossus, Spidey, etc
  
• Mediumweights Captain Britain, Spider-Woman, Beast, etc.
  
• [peak of] Normal Human Strength Captain America, Wolverine, DareDevil, etc.
  

In that breakdown, the Thing was in the second category and Colossus in the third.
Here's the pic
[spoiler][/spoiler]

[herodad1]

in the marvel universe handbook colossus is 70 ton range/ the thing is 85.that was in the 80's.now i'd guess petey's somewhere around 75-80 ton range.colossus may be able to take more punishment  than the thing in certain instances( steel/ rock) but when it comes to a beat down its hard to beat ben grimm.yeah ive noticed the strong guys getting the shaft alot from writers.me...ive always liked the strong guy characters.the beast is another one who always the first to go down despite his speed and agility.

[B A D]

Ben Grimm. With one  hand. While holding Kings and 10's in the other.

[Jef-El]

The Thing. Stronger, more experienced, and probably trickier too.

[herodad1]

also ben grew up in a rough neighborhood giving him that savy whereas peter is a warm-hearted russian farm boy.even the training the prof. has given him cant put that in him.

[Night Dragon]

 And something else alot of folks tend to forget, Ben was a former military man, so he has recieved at the very least basic HtH training on top of street fighting.

But, in all honesty, it all comes down to the writer, and who they would want to win.

[Protomorph]

Also remember the many power-ups that these characters have had over the years since these books were published. Thing, Hulk, Colossus, Spidey, Iron Man, Shulkie, Beast, WonderMan (to name a few) have all had strength enhancements.

[GrizzlyBearTalon]

Off Topic About Chart
[spoiler]The thing that amuses me in that strength chart page is the VAST gulf of differential power in the third class, the first two, and the latter ones are all more reasonable but seeings Colossus, Spider-Man and Silver Surfer all in the same class is amusing.[/spoiler]

Off Topic About portrayal of Bruisers
[spoiler]Yeah bruisers seem to get the short end of the stick usually, a lot of times their combat skill is just kinda forgotten about to prove a villains power. Yet on the other hand any time these same punching bags turn evil... or something... they just tend to utterly demolish everyone. Still though of all the characters on the team they often have the most visceral/obvious power and it is usually easier to demonstrate. Smacking down Colossus or Ben just ultimately seems to be the easiest "comic cliche" to establish "BadA**itude" really the same result could be achieved by having Human Torch/Storm/Cyclops unleash a huge blast on em or whatever. Still though, they often at least bring the bruisers back into the fight pretty quickly but if it is someone like Cyclops or Human Torch getting the pimp slap by an Arch Villain they usually get to sit the whole thing out.[/spoiler]

On Topic
As far as the Strength enhancements go, I know it has been stated several times that Ben's strength enhances as time passes and with each of his mutations/changes in form early on. Reed had noted that several times in the comics & in other sources it has came up, not to mention the impact he gets from training on the specialized equipment.

A lot of these same things apply to Colossus as well, especially the training aspects and such. I know for a good while he used to be the "strongest mutant on earth" physically at least. Not sure if that still holds true, he might have been dethroned however if he was with that whole "de-powered mutants" event maybe he got it back?

Still though overall any increases in their power for both of them seem to be along the same lines & for similar reasons so they'd probably end up around the same levels comparatively as always. If anything the time period in which Peter was inactive and being tortured (in the Astonishing X-men comics) compared to Ben being active would make the gap still end up being Thing is a bit stronger with Colossus a bit tougher.

One more for the road!
[spoiler]P.S. I just wanted to play with the spoiler tags! :gbtclaw[/spoiler]

[ow_tiobe_sb]

FWIW, there was an Amazing Spider Man annual panel someone posted a while back (with a pic at http://i6.tinypic.com/1z672af.jpg) by Mark Guenwald and Bob Layton with the strong characters broken down into the following categories:

• Super-Heavyweights Hulk, Thor, Hercules, Wonder Man, etc.
  
• Heavyweights Thing, Sub-Mariner, Sasquatch, etc
  
• Super-Mediumweights She-Hulk, Luke Cage, Colossus, Spidey, etc
  
• Mediumweights Captain Britain, Spider-Woman, Beast, etc.
  
• [peak of] Normal Human Strength Captain America, Wolverine, DareDevil, etc.
  

In that breakdown, the Thing was in the second category and Colossus in the third.

I think Black Bolt best summarised my thoughts on these categories when he said, "                                     ."

I wonder how Spider-Man sorted these out: did he have each super being line up behind his back, have each threaten him in turn, and then allow his spider-sense to determine the level of each threat? :P  I would have called upon either Reed Richards or Dr. Strange to make more scientific or mystical divinations of these categories.  That's not to say that Peter Parker, with enough time and effort, would not devise a way to measure these strength levels, but both Mr. Fantastic and the good doctor would determine these levels in a fraction of the time.

ow_tiobe_sb
Phantom Bunburyist and The Prat in the Hat