DJ's Den

[Cyber Burn]

Stahlhelm looks fantastic DJ, great. Your texture and detail work are fantastic. I didn't think it would be possible to improve on this, but I'm glad to have been proven wrong. 

Alright, another tease/WIP of the one I teased earlier..

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IF you look at this one and back and Stahlhelm, you can see the point I was making about the awards/medals.  Unlike Stahlhelm, this guy wears his medals out loud and proud.  They are:  Knight's Cross (around collar area), Iron Cross Second Class (ribbon in button hole), Silver Close Combat Medal (over left pocket; awarded for 30 consecutive days of "hand-to-hand" combat without armour support), Silver Wound Badge (left side of left pocket; wounded 3 to 4 times in combat), Iron Cross First Class (center left pocket), and the Silver Anti-Partisan Medal (right left pocket; awarded for 30 consecutive days of combat against a partisan unit).  Also note the shoulder boards, Stahlhelm shows that he is a Captain in the Waffen-SS Infantry while this fellow is a Technical Sergeant  in the Waffen-SS Combat Engineer Unit (they were the only ones who regularly issued flamethrowers).  I've still got some work to do, as you can see..but this guy will be interesting when I get him done..I hope...

Already interesting. I have to say that I'm really impressed with the research you had to have put in to know all about the medals, their meanings, and their locations. I mean I'm extremely impressed. While I liked the original version, this one shows just how much you've grown and improved since then.   

[Deaths Jester]

Alright, another WIP look at this character with the flames:

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Ortho WIP

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Face wipage

Now, some of you are probably saying to yourself, "How is that a wip? That looks done, DJ."

Yeah...no.  There is still a lot of work to do on the face and I don't mean hair either (this character is bald).  It'll probably be awhile before you guys see this character again because what I plan on doing requires me to delve into my collection of tutorials and references again and hope that what I have can help me create what I'm thinking of....

[Podmark]

Well even now he looks fantastic. Great job on the tank on the back.

[Deaths Jester]

So, I need some outside input on what I've done to the Nazi fire bug's face.  Right now it looks like this:

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Now, I've got some problems and they might just be in my head for all we know.  First off, there's a part of me that wants to take this burn marking and go all around the head but there's another part that says that where I got it is perfect.  Add to that a third side says stop where I'm at but do something to make the burn more natural looking and work the edges so they ease better.  I'm not sure what to do, truthfully....so I need some outside input from you blokes!  SO no just looking and moving on this time around...(I see you blokes just staring and wandering off)....pipe up and say stuff!!!!

[detourne_me]

It looks disgustingly great DJ. If you do stop there, you could give him a shock of hair on the unburnt side.

[daglob]

... and maybe half an eyebrow.

[Podmark]

I'd stop there but ease the edges. Keep the non-symmetrical look. Really amazing looking!

[Deaths Jester]

... and maybe half an eyebrow.

With the pieces I'm using the eyebrows get lost behind the googles. I found that out when I did Chinook.

As for hair...I don't know...never envisioned him with hair...will ponder it.

I' stop there but ease the edges. Keep the non-symmetrical look. Really amazing looking!

It doer work better asymmetrical...I tried a full face look and even with rome extra reworks, it read poorly.

[Deaths Jester]

Alright..here's the finished version of what I've been working on...I'm calling him Brandstifter (German for Firebug)....(be warned, the ortho pics are a bit large because I had to use Nifskope to get a good detailed shot of everything)....

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Body Ortho

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Face Ortho

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Action pic


Note: I tried the hair idea the DM mentioned but unhappily everything I tried looked like it was pasted on, not natural.  So I went with out...

[doctorchallenger]

Just... wow.

Wow.

[Deaths Jester]

Just another tease....

[RTTingle]

Oooooooo!

[Cyber Burn]

Truly inspiring DJ. Your attention to detail is phenomenal.

[Deaths Jester]

...hint hint...I don't always post wips here...sometimes I post them over at the Freedom Reborn Discord Server Tomato set up (see his post in General Discussion)...

EDIT: I have a correction to make on the fire bug's award info. The silver Anti-Partisan medal was for 50 days of combatting "partisans". It also turns out that what the Germans considered "combating partisans" also included removal of "underirables" (read: Jewish, Gypsies, ect) within recently occupied regions. This was very new info to me...had no idea that they awarded this medal for that. That combind with the flamethrower on firebug could make him a bit more sinister than I originally believed but I'm not going to go that way with his bio even though it would make it that more fulfilling when you kick his arse in game with a patriotic character. Will say that only one other of this collection will wear this medal (because of how the character fits into the team) and it will be for fighting partisans only (same with firebug) - I'm not going to include such evil in these characters, no matter how historically correct it maybe. If not for how the other character fits as an actual partisan fighter, I wouldn't include the medal at all knowing the full info on what it was awarded for. These skins aren't made to celebrate the Nazis and what they did. They are made to be beaten up in game because they are Nazis and are evil. Okay, back to regular show...

[Deaths Jester]

Okay, new member of the team..kinda.  When Carr and I first collaborated together on this Nazi team, we had a list of about 20 archetypes that we'd put together that pretty much encompassed the mainstay archetypes that both the JLA/JSA and Avengers had (ie: The archer - Green Arrow/Hawkeye; The Bruiser - Wildcat/Wolverine, ect).  From there we split the list in half (I got 10, Carr got 10) and went from there developing the team.  Right now you are probably wondering what this has to do with this new post, right? Well, back when we were doing the collab, Carr pulled the Detective/Stealth Specialist archetype (Batman/Moon Knight) and created:

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Night Owl or Nachteule (Thanks to Cyberburn for saving these pics from back then)

Well, since I'm doing my own images of them, I decided to take that same archetype and create, Nacht:

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Nacht action shot

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Ortho

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Face

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Awards


Now there are a few things to call out on Nacht that need explaining:

1) The awards - he wears the Iron Cross 1st class (middle of pocket), Iron Cross second class (button hole ribbon), and the Silver Anti-Partisan badge (50 days of fighting partisans and the last one of these I'm doing after discovering more about what else this award was given out for - as mentioned above).


2) The coat - First up, the black coat is to represent he is a member of the Gestapo (as does the SD within a black diamond patch - the white piping around that patch denotes he's a member of Gestapo and no the regular SD).  While the Gestapo didn't actually have uniform (inside Greater Germany they wore plain clothes/undercover and in occupied regions wore the SD uniform), they often wore black leather overcoats because it provided them a little extra protection while they were undercover and looked "non-conspicuous" amongst the regular populace. Normally officers - they could purchase the coat in their branch colour at their own expense - weren't allowed to wear insignia on leather coat (aside from their shoulder boards).  Nacht,as you can see, breaks that convention.  Reasoning behind that revolves around the fact that this is actually his costume..not his uniform.  Nacht is the type of man that is the man of 1,000 faces - he spends all his time in the field in disguise, only putting on this outfit when he must report to a commanding officer or some important meeting.  Thus, when he appears in this outfit, he wears insignia to denote his branch (Gestapo due to the diamond SD badge with piping) and section (SS per the eagle on the sleeve).  In the field, he relies on his sidekick (coming later..maybe) to correspond with the soldiers/commanders and to attest that he is who he says he is (the sidekick wears a uniform most of the time).

3) The colour of the uniform - you'll notice that instead using field grey on the uniform, I used a grey with a bluish-green tint to it.  Even though Hollywood normally portrays the Gestapo wearing the black SS uniform, that uniform was discontinued in 1938/39 and the full stock was recalled by Himmler.  The black uniform stock was stripped of insignia and then handed out to the non-Germanic volunteer SS units.  The rest of the SS started wearing the field grey of the Waffen-SS except for the Panzer divisions and the police. The police/RHSA wore the grey with a blue-green tint coloured uniform pictured and what I tried to exhibit in the skin. Well, pictures I've seen of the SD uniforms show them having that bluish-green tint at least:

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SD Uniforms




4) He wears the SS-Sturmbannführer (equivalent to Major in US ranks) collar board on the right. The blank collar board on the left was something that was only worn by members of the SD/RHSA...it helped separate them from the other SS-based commands.

5) No shoulder boards - didn't find a mesh piece that would work with the trenchcoat and not show up underneath as well...so no shoulder boards.  Besides, he rarely wears this outfit anyway.

6) The mask - as you know, most of my original characters don't wear masks.  They just don't seem very realistic to me most of the time but for someone like Nacht - whose identity needs to stay hidden to all but a select few - it works.  Thus a mask...

Okay, that's enough of me rambling....

[Podmark]

That's some crazy historical detail you're doing there. Great skin.

[Deaths Jester]

Yeah, it is a lot of historical detail but it's best to do it so I don't run into inaccuracies or trouble like the anti-partisan badge. If I had just done a little wider research on it, I would've never used it because of the absolulety horrorific actions that it was some times rewarded for (not that fighting the Resistance wasn't horrific enough but in war both sides fight partisan forces...no side should be liquidating people because they don't match certain requirements or rewarding awards for that.) Now I know more and will not use it again and make sure to lean the bios of the two with the badge away from that track and more towards actual partisan-based battles instead.

[Deaths Jester]

Alright, here's what I've got done on Nacht's sidekick:

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Tease

Still got a long way to go but let's get the history details out of the way now so later you guys can appreciate the full skin without all my rambling.

1) As you can tell, she's wearing the SD uniform in that blueish-green grey that I used on Nacht also.

2) The left sleeve - starting at the shoulder we have: the SS eagle (denoting she's a member of the SS); the Private, First Class pip (or lozenge as the Americans called it) which I will get to in a minute; the SD diamond without piping (that denotes she is a member of the SD proper and not a Gestapo or such); the SD-Hauptamt cuff title which denotes she is a member of the SD Main Security Office Staff  (a high ranking staff position for people within the SD; like being a staff member to Himmler or such type position)

3) Ribbon bar (above left pocket, from left to right) -
              SS Long Service Badge - Awarded for extended service within the SS; has four grades of 4, 12, 18, and 25 years of services - this is the 4 year
              grade, I think...not really a distinguisher for the long service ribbons, unlike the medals
         Sudentenland Medal - Awarded to all military personnel who marched into the Sudetenland on October 18, 1938
         Anschluss Medal - Awarded to those who marched into and annexed Austria on May 1, 1938
         Memel Medal - last of the occupation Medals Awarded; Presented to all personnel who distinguished themselves in actions related to the annexation
              of the Klaipeda Region of Lithuania on March 22, 1939

4) The badge on the left pocket, is the NSDAP/Nazi Party badge denoting she is a member of the Nazi Party (not everyone within the Army, Navy, SS, ect were actual members of the NSDAP)

5) Her collar boards show her to hold the rank of SS-Mann, or Private (the striped black and white trimmed collar boards were issued to Privates from 1934-1940 before the trim was gotten rid of).  As mentioned, the pip on her sleeve denotes she's a Private, First Class.  Now, you are probably wondering why she has such a low rank?  In truth, it's amazing she holds a rank within the SS because women - except in certain areas of the Luftwaffe (those that manned AA guns) and the Signals Corp on the Army though both groups were viewed as inferior to the men - were viewed as auxiliaries and not given ranks.  The German Nazis viewed women more as - for lack of a better term - brood mares (they even had an award in varying grades - plain for 3 or 4, silver for 6 to 8, ect - for mothers that had multiple children).  So, the fact that this one has a rank in the SS is a major thing and they would most likely believe her when she attested to Nacht being Nacht.

6) Even though she probably should have at least an Iron Cross Second Class due to her potentially helping Nacht earn his Iron Cross First Class, she possess no Iron Cross.  The reason is because the Iron Cross was only ever awarded to one female - Hannah Reitsch, a test pilot who received both classes - during the whole war.

Okay...that's enough history for now..off I go to more skinning...

[Deaths Jester]

Alright..a little further along with the female..

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Ortho WIP

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Hair Up-close

Still got to decide if I want to have her wear a mask (maybe a domino one) or if I should just do the eyes and eyebrows and call it quits.  Also, NOT ALL GERMANS HAD BLONDE HAIR!!  Actually, most within the Nazi Party didn't....so meh....

[Deaths Jester]

Back when Car and I did the collab, I created the sidekick archetype and came up with this:

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Schwarz Maske

Well, now that I'm redoing most of the archetypes in my own way..I bring about Nacht's sidekick:

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Nebel (Fog) ortho

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Nebel Face

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Nacht (right) und Nebel (left)

For the history info, see the previous posts above.  And this will probably be it for awhile seeing as there aren't any that interested in these skins....

[Cyber Burn]

  And this will probably be it for awhile seeing as there aren't any that interested in these skins....

Lies!!!

All drunken lies!!!

<--- Very interested!!!


Of course it will be a while before I would be able to use them, but I would still love to have them. 

[daglob]

Yeah, my computer won't run either game these days, but that doesn't stop me from wanting these fantastic skins/scopes.

[Podmark]

Interesting changes. Gives it much more of a soldier vibe to the original's superhero vibe.
Great skin. I quite like the eyes.

[Cyber Burn]

Interesting changes. Gives it much more of a soldier vibe to the original's superhero vibe.
Great skin. I quite like the eyes.

That's an excellent way of articulating this Pod.

And DJ, considering her partner wears a full face Mask, I'd be interested in seeing a version of her with the Domino Mask, or at least some sort of Mask (Maybe as an Alt Skin?).

While Nebel currently looks breathtaking, it kind of feels like she's the Robin to Nacht's Batman, and while Robin is running around without his Mask, it leaves Batman's identity open for speculation.

[Deaths Jester]

Interesting changes. Gives it much more of a soldier vibe to the original's superhero vibe.
Great skin. I quite like the eyes.

That's an excellent way of articulating this Pod.

And DJ, considering her partner wears a full face Mask, I'd be interested in seeing a version of her with the Domino Mask, or at least some sort of Mask (Maybe as an Alt Skin?).

While Nebel currently looks breathtaking, it kind of feels like she's the Robin to Nacht's Batman, and while Robin is running around without his Mask, it leaves Batman's identity open for speculation.

But how would the German military officials know that she is who she says she is then?  Bad enough that they have Nacht running around all incognito/man of a thousand faces almost all the time, now Nebel should be that way too?  She's the official face for Nacht when he's in the field and can attest to who is and isn't Nacht.  And Nacht only wears his mask when he is in an official meeting or such with German officials/commanding officers (mostly when he is called back to HQ to report or such)..so he's more often dressed in something else with a different face..that isn't his.  But fine...I'll look at the domino mask again...I tried it once and wasn't happy with it....

[deanjo2000]

Personally I'd give her a scar or other facial disfigurement and that's how she's recognised throughout the regime. So even people who don't know her will know her reputation and telltale markings. Really nice skins and you've definatly brought your ideas to life. 

[Deaths Jester]

I think part of the problem is everyone is thinking of Nebel as Robin to Nacht's Batman. Because she's a member of the SD, she's more like Microchip to Punisher or Oracle to Batman instead. Someone who is more about pumping info from informants, digging thru files, and informing Nazi police/officials where to be when Nacht brings down some "anti-Germany disodents" and who NOT to shot at (id Nacht for them) than fighting side-by-side with Nacht (though wien needed see can). She has no need of a mask to be that type of sidekick...in fact, it might help her to not have one (less likely to draw attention and ppl might not connect her as easily to Nacht...just a random "maybe" thought there).

I'll drag up some history about the SD that shows why I see her that way (more large blocks of history text) and post it some time tomorrow along with a masked version and a tease.

[UnkoMan]

I like her without the mask.
To be honest I first thought of characters such as Margo Lane or Dian Belmont, though without the sexualized connotations of that.
Maybe like... a secretary?

Anyhow, amazing amount of research put into these characters. Love that.

[Deaths Jester]

Alright...here's how Nebel looks masked:

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Still looks bland to me, though.  And because I'm going to be paraphrasing a lot of different texts and books, I'm just going to give the run down on the SD in a quote:

SD, or Sicherheitsdienst, was the intelligence agency of the SS and the Nazi Party in Nazi Germany. The organization was the first Nazi intelligence organization to be established and was considered a sister organization with the Gestapo, which the SS had infiltrated heavily after 1934. Between 1933 and 1939, the SD was administered as an independent SS office, after which it was transferred to the authority of the Reich Main Security Office (Reichssicherheitshauptamt; RSHA), as one of its seven departments/offices. Its first director, Reinhard Heydrich, intended for the SD to bring every single individual within the Third Reich's reach under "continuous supervision." They were tasked with the detection of actual or potential enemies of the Nazi leadership and the neutralization of this opposition as the action against the SA demonstrated. To fulfill this task, the SD created an organization of agents and informants throughout the Reich and later throughout the occupied territories, all part of the development of an extensive SS state and a totalitarian regime without parallel. The organization consisted of a few hundred full-time agents and several thousand informants.  Given the nature of the intelligence operations assigned to the SD, there were clear delineations between what constituted a full member (Mitglieder) of the SD and those who were considered "associates" (Mitarbeiter) with a further subset for clerical support personnel (typists, file clerks, etc.) who were connoted as V-persons (Vertrauensleute). All SD personnel, whether simply associates or full members were required to swear an oath of secrecy, had to meet all the requirements for SS membership, were assigned SD code numbers (Chiffre Nummer) and if they were above the level of V-person"they had to carry an SD identification card.
Part and parcel to intelligence operations, the SD carefully tracked foreign opinion and criticism of Nazi policies, censoring when necessary and likewise publishing hostile political cartoons in the SS weekly magazine, Das Schwarze Korps.An additional task assigned to the SD and the Gestapo was keeping tabs on the morale of the German population at large, which meant they were charged to "carefully supervise the political health of the German ethnic body" and once any symptoms of "disease and germs" appeared, it was their job to "remove them by every appropriate means." Regular reports - ranging from opinion polls, press dispatches, and information bulletins were established. These were monitored and reviewed by then head of the Inland-SD, Otto Ohlendorf (responsible for intelligence and security within Germany) and the former Heidelberg professor and SD member Reinhard Höhn, all designed to control and assess the "life domain" or Lebensgebiet of the German population. Gathered information was then distributed by the SD through secret internal political reports entitled Meldungen aus dem Reich (reports from the Reich) to the upper echelons of the Nazi Party, enabling Hitler's regime to evaluate the general morale and attitude of the German people so it could be timely manipulated by the Nazi propaganda machine.

In 1938, the SD was made the intelligence organization for the State as well as for the Party, supporting the Gestapo and working with the General and Interior Administration. They were mainly the information-gathering agency, and the Gestapo, and to a degree the Criminal Police (Kriminalpolizei or Kripo), was the executive agency of the political police system. Both SD and Gestapo were under Heydrich's control and answered to Himmler in his dual capacity of Chief of the Police and Reichsfuhrer-SS. Nevertheless, the Criminal Police kept a level of independence since its structure was longer-established.

SD men represented no pathological or psychically susceptible group. Few were wild or extreme Nazi fanatics. In those respects they were 'ordinary men'. Yet in most other respects, they were an extraordinary mix of men, drawn together by a unique mix of missions. Along with members of the Gestapo, SD personnel were "regarded with a mixture of fear and foreboding," and people wanted as little to do with them as possible. Belonging to the security apparatus of the Third Reich obviously had its advantages but it was also fraught with occupationally related social disadvantages as well, and if post-war descriptions of the SD by historians are any indication, membership therein implied being a part of a "ubiquitous secret society" which was "sinister" and a "messenger of terror" not just for the German population, but within the "ranks of the Nazi Party itself."

As you can see, SD were really the information specialists - they had their informants plus gathered all the info that came in from the Gestapo and police.  True they would go out in the field and they had the ability to arrest anyone at anytime if they suspected of "foul doings" but that was a smaller section of what the SD did.  Why would someone who was viewed as an "ordinary person" working as - for lack of a better term - one of many information brokers (SD were more than that but in the end Nebel fits into that idea a bit) for the Nazi party need a mask?

EDIT: Also, unlike the group that Car and I did, this group is going to have more supporting personnel involved - not everyone is going to be a front line/in the filed type.  Car and I were just pumping out characters that we though were cool and fit some idea we had at the beginning of our collab but as I got deeper into it, certain characters started crying to be more supporting-types (Herr Gummiband was the first one that started crying the loudest even though I had already skinned him as a bit of a front lien type...when you see the redesign you'll see a major difference).  Nebel is one of those newer supporting character ideas....Geisteblitz, Herr Gummiband, and der Zauberer (partially) when/if they get a redesign will also be more along the lines of supporting characters than the front line group they originally appeared as.  Stay around and you'll see what I mean if I ever get around to do those....or such..

Okay..now here be the tease:

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This one will come with two skins....and maybe some different swirly thingies..got to talk with DM about something when I get closer to the polish section on the skin.

[Cyber Burn]

This looks really interesting. Plus I like the supporting characters idea. I think I would reinstall everything just to play around with these.     I'm really happy to see these guys getting updates.