Batman v Superman

[catwhowalksbyhimself]

They are making Batman the older, experienced hero and for some reason want to make the looking up to Batman thing literal.

[JeyNyce]

This is sounding more like a Batman fanboy film.  If I remember correctly Supes is 6'2" and Bats is 6'1".  I'm 6'6", put ME in the movie and let them both look up to me!

[stumpy]

Why does it always have to be about Batman with DC?  I like Batman, I really do, but sheesh do they really need to readjust their priorities.  I want to see all characters shine, not whimper in the shadow of the Master of Brooding.

I wonder if it has anything to do with the fact that the recent Batman movies were basically Warner's biggest positively received movies based on popular DC characters in the past 20 years? I mean, perhaps MoS did well in theaters, but there really wasn't nearly the positive reaction to it that there was to many of the recent Marvel-based movies, and Superman is DC's flagship character who everyone on the planet instantly recognizes versus characters like Iron Man and Thor who many people (outside of comic fans) have only vaguely heard of before their movies. Not to mention that the end of MoS left many actual fans shaking their heads.

BTW, I am not against major characters who have different approaches and motivations for their actions butting heads in a movie. That sort of friction can add an interesting dynamic to the story and provide an opportunity for the writers to explain why the heroes do what they do. It worked well in The Avengers, to take the obvious example. But, in this case, it would be appropriate (by which I mean "consistent with the underlying characters of both") that any disagreement over methodology be set against a backdrop where each hero treats the others with the respect that they have earned.

Unfortunately, that snippet doesn't make it sound like that's the approach being taken with this next movie. Both Affleck and Cavill are old enough that both characters should be played as grown-ups. Playing one as the young pup learning the ropes while the other is the grizzled veteran will just be weird for two well established characters. Too much of a Batman-and-Robin feel. And, though I can't be sure exactly what Roven meant, if the implication of Affleck "towering" over Cavill is supposed to be that Superman will be intimidated by Batman, then they are totally losing me. Batman is an impressive hero, but Superman isn't going to be intimidated because someone else is tall or has a scary persona. He wasn't intimidated by Zod and he wouldn't be intimidated by Batman, even if Batman knows his secret ID or has kryptonite or whatever other crutch they will be using to make that dynamic seem reasonable to the apologists.

Anyway, I agree that far too little of what I am hearing about this movie excites me to see it. I am not predicting disaster or anything. Despite things I didn't like about it, I saw MoS, I had fun watching it, and I am planning to watch this next installment as well. But, it would be sort of nice if more of the little tidbits they are leaking about it left me thinking, "Excellent! It sounds like that are getting it right." rather than, "Sigh. They should have hired people who actually understand the characters."

[John Jr.]

DC/WB announced their future movies:

http://www.bleedingcool.com/2014/10/15/jason-momoa-is-aquaman-and-green-lantern-will-be-a-reboot/

[BentonGrey]

Your last statement is spot on, Stumpy.

Interesting, JJ. 

Well, supposedly Aquaman is getting a solo movie, and once again, if you had told me that a decade ago, I couldn't have imagined not being excited about it.  Now...not so much.  Also, the guy they've supposedly cast as Barry Allen looks...well...interesting.

[catwhowalksbyhimself]

The lineup seems optimistic.  I mean, it might workout, but there's no guarantee that the DC's attempt at a movie universe will do well enough to justify such a push.  Marvel started out a bit more slowly.  They are shoving them out the door now because the Marvel Movieverse is a proven thing, to the point where people are willing to watching something they've never heard of (Guardians of the Galaxy) because they trust the brand--and they come out the theatre not the least disappointed with that decision.

DC's planning this all branching off a single film that was received as okay but not all the good (although it did make money) without the brand reputation that Marvel has and with plenty of disappointments behind them. It could all go horribly wrong, easily.  It might not, but I'm not as hopeful as they apparently are.

[BentonGrey]

It might not, but I'm not as hopeful as they apparently are.

That's because the folks in charge at WB are demonstrably idiots. 

Good points, though Cat.  On the other hand, I can't imagine a Superman/Batman film will tank, and as long as it makes unholy amounts of money, it won't matter how bad it is. *looks at everything Michael Bay touches*

[Podmark]

And even if Batman v Superman fails on some level they just cancel/downsize their plans. Planning doesn't really hurt WB, unless they don't leave themselves proper flexibility.
I imagine WB is feeling a lot of pressure to build something that can compare to Marvel.

[trebean]

Batman being taller than Supes and Clark needing to "look up to Batman" sounds really strange to me. Shouldn't Superman be the more physically imposing one? (Although maybe I should check their official sizes before I make statements like that).

Supes IS taller in the comics. Gaah, I saw some signs of it and ignored it but gaashdaamniit  they're totally making Superman into Batman Lite Extra Powered.

[Jimaras8]

Um, guys i am not a DC expert but does the guy playing Arthur has anything in common with the comic version. Because this isn't how i remember Aquaman 

[BentonGrey]

He's vaguely reminiscent of the bearded, bedraggled loser version of Aquaman with the hook hand, but in general, I agree, Jim.

[stumpy]

Um, guys i am not a DC expert but does the guy playing Arthur has anything in common with the comic version. Because this isn't how i remember Aquaman 

First thought: Bilateral symmetry? (I almost can't hear a "something in common" question without thinking of that quote from the great Justice League animated series.)


Second thought: I am pretty sure part of the traditional Aquaman backstory is that he marries a woman given to him by her evil/insane brother. She attempts to bear his child, but instead gives birth to three dragons. Classic Aquaman. Totally.


Seriously, I don't know anything about that actor really, but he might be fine as Aquaman. I think I am basically giving up on Hollywood coming up with actors who I will think "look" like the comic book character they are supposed to play. At the end of the day, I just don't think that's even what they are trying to do when they cast these roles. And, really, maybe they don't need to. I doubt that I would have thought that Christian Bale really seemed much like Batman before the recent run of movies. But, despite other issues with his portrayal, I think he pulled it off. Anyway, my point is that I don't think the studios are trying to match the comic book image of the characters (except in an archetypal way), or what a comics fan might think they'd look like in real life, or choose actors whose earlier roles remind us of the character or make us think the actor could also play the character.

[Podmark]

Some news on Batman's potential side kick:

Spoiler

It's been reported that an extra on set claims that Jena Malone will be playing Carrie Kelly/Robin in Batman V Superman.
http://www.newsarama.com/22482-weird-report-rumor-jena-malone-to-play-female-robin-in-batman-v-superman.html

I have mixed feelings on this. On the one hand I don't mind using a female Robin (we might have one in the regular comics soon), but on the other hand I don't like how they are tying this version of Batman to the old man of Dark Knight Returns. That works great for an Elsworlds one shot, but it's not what I would want for the ongoing DC movie verse. Then again Ben Affleck is playing the character and he's not that old so I guess it's more inspiration than anything else.

[BentonGrey]

I really hope that's not true, as it's asinine.

Spoiler

I like that story for what it is, but there's only one character that deserves to come to the big screen as Robin.  And don't tell me he already has.  No.  He hasn't.

I suppose I can't have much less interest in this project at this point, so it doesn't really matter.

On the topic of the Superman/Batman height difference, it recently struck me just how stupid this is, and in fact, how much it messes with the entire archetypal dynamic between the two characters.  I was watching JLU, and Superman and Batman were arguing about something.  Supes stalks up to Batman, looming over him by a few inches, and shoves his finger in Batman's face.  Batman stands stock-still, completely unmoved by the anger of the man in front of him.  It's the same moment we've seen in tons of movies and TV shows, but here it's a subtle emphasis of the dynamic between these two figures.  The thing is, Batman SHOULD be moved by Superman's anger.  He should flinch, he should shrink, he should blink, because Superman is a freaking sun-god out of mythology, powerful enough to literally annihilate Bruce with a look, burn him right to ash.  The power differential is communicated visually without Superman doing a thing.  Just the height difference drives home that the one is more powerful than the other, and yet the other is unmoved.  Their heights, like the rest of their appearances, is all symbolically a reflection of that relationship.  The really cool part is, comic writers got this so long ago that they made it canon that Superman is taller. 

[Tomato]

Hrm.

... Yeah, I really don't know what to say anymore. My reaction to every bit of news, every casting decision, every poster or trailer about this movie or the ones following it is... Hrm. I'm at the point where every time something new pops up I just start chanting "at least it should have good action figures, at least it should have good action figures" to myself in the vain hope that it somehow makes up for the storm of utter garbage I've heard about these films.

[Shogunn2517]

At least whats-her-name looked pretty good as Wonder Woman...

[Tomato]

Something amusing just occurred to me... they went out of their way to make a Batman that Superman would have to look up to, yeah? Well... Jason Momoa (Aquaman's actor) is 6'4" tall, making him taller than both Superman AND Batman, meaning they both have to look up to the King of the Seas.

[BentonGrey]

Something amusing just occurred to me... they went out of their way to make a Batman that Superman would have to look up to, yeah? Well... Jason Momoa (Aquaman's actor) is 6'4" tall, making him taller than both Superman AND Batman, meaning they both have to look up to the King of the Seas.

Heh.  I rather enjoy that.

[stumpy]

It's all downhill from here. In the next movie, they'll to a time-traveling crossover and get someone 7'1" to play Gim "Colossal Boy" Allon and it will be all over. 

[Shogunn2517]

Although I'm pretty sure it was said already and not sure if this is the proper thread for it, but this is further confirmation:

Spoiler

The DC television and cinematic universes are completely separate.  And it's stupid.
http://www.techtimes.com/articles/18148/20141019/warner-bros-casting-ezra-miller-as-the-flash-proves-tv-and-film-universes-are-separate.htm
Ezra Miller will be playing the Flash in a stand alone film.  Not sure if he'll be in BvS, though it's likely since they're announcing his casting NOW.  But by all accounts, Grant Gustin is killing it as Flash.  Just as Stephen Amell has nailed Green Arrow.  But it's all for naught because they are separate.  Speaking of getting things right, Marvel's cinematic universe has not only Agents of SHIELD, but have also added the Defenders series' to the Cinematic universe as well.  That's five separate series that greatly expand and give better scope to what we know to be a large universe. Why DC feels the need to go completely against the grain is beyond me.

[John Jr.]

You know, I think these two will be way better than the movie, specially the last one...

http://www.newsarama.com/22598-batman-v-superman-dawn-of-justice-teaser-trailer-as-animated-by-a-fan.html

[BentonGrey]

JJ, I have complete confidence in HISHE's ability to outdo Snyder any day of the week.  They're pure genius! 

[JeyNyce]

First look at Aqua man

http://i.imgur.com/F7ppP1U.jpg

[murs47]

First look at Aqua man

http://i.imgur.com/F7ppP1U.jpg

Aquaman finally looks cool. (Don't fight it, Benton. Just let it happen.)

[BentonGrey]

Urg....well, it's no worse than I expected. Let's see, I'll start with the positive, I guess...

He doesn't have a hook...that's good, I suppose?

His pointless shoulder armor is somewhat goldish...

He's got a trident; that is definitely cool.

He looks super fierce, so at least they seem to be taking him seriously (even if in the wrong way). That is probably a good thing in the long run, as there is a chance that even the Namor-lite version of the character showing up on the big screen will help get rid of the Aqua-hate he experiences.

I do really like the "Unite the Seven" slogan. If I had the slightest amount of respect for the powers behind this movie, that would really excite me. Of course, chances are that "the Seven" aren't really the Seven.

As for the bad, well, he doesn't look right for the part, and he's basically got the 90s era Aquaman look going on, with tattoos...for some reason. It definitely looks like they're going for the Namor-lite angry Aquaman version, which is a thoroughly dislikable character.

I understand the reasoning for the choices revealed here, and they are more or less what I expected. Sadly, that doesn't mean I'm not still disappointed. I would be a lot more so if I had any hope for these films.  Hopefully they will be good for the character in the long run, even if they have nothing for me.

[HarryTrotter]

^Like Benton said,at least they are taking him seriously.
Its better then I expected.And definitly not the weirdest thing DC  did with their upcoming cinematic universe.

[Starman]

I'm surprised there aren't more complaints here considering the previous passionate dislike for Jason Momoa's casting 

IMO, Momoa looks cool ... as expected, they went with the Peter David-era warrior king Aquaman and Snyder's team didn't drop the ball. You can always rely on Snyder for visuals.

It's still kind of amusing that Aquaman is going to be the "tough guy" of the Justice League, though

[hoss20]

First look at Aqua man

http://i.imgur.com/F7ppP1U.jpg

This isn't supposed to be anything official, is it? Judging by the site it is hosted on, I would hope not. It looks like a bad Photoshop job done by a fanboy.

[spydermann93]

It's as official as it gets, I'm afraid. The picture was posted by Snyder, himself, on his Twitter.

Personally, I'm not disappointed in the design that much. It fits the design style of the MoS universe (at least, I think so), so I have to give it credit for fitting in.

While I'm glad that they're taking Aquaman seriously, I hope that they aren't trying to take him too seriously. You know, like trying too hard to make him bad*** and "cool".

I just hope that they let his actual character make people like him, not try and force us to like him.

[BentonGrey]

It was tweeted by Snyder, according to what I saw.

:EDIT: Ninja'd by Spider. 

Yeah Spyder, 'trying too hard' seems to be the watchword of current DC adaptations.