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Author Topic: DC Comics Reboot  (Read 52486 times)

Offline B A D

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DC Comics Reboot
« on: August 10, 2011, 04:50:53 PM »
Is pretty ....well... stupid.

Don't know what more to say about it. While Marvel seems to have righted its ship, and is steeped in continuity and <gasp> good stories (Herc, Future Foundations, Avengers, Captain America are all titles I started reading again),  DC has gone off the deep end and decided "hey, one more crisis couldn't hurt."

Well, don't know about you gang, but Im not interested in starting from scratch again. So I'm dropping every one of my DC books (which was down to 5 anyway) and trying some indies until they get their heads out of their butts over there.
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Offline BentonGrey

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Re: DC Comics Reboot
« Reply #1 on: August 12, 2011, 05:31:05 AM »
Ehh, I've written about it on 'Mato's forum a good deal, so I won't rehash everything here, but I will say one thing that bears repeating.  For years and years I've been saying that DC needs to start with a clean slate, just wipe away continuity and just start over again.  They've made too many mistakes to fix with their selective editing.  What I've wished for (hoped against hope for) was for them to start over, but with clear directions.  I wanted them to know where Batman was going to end up, what would happen to Aquaman, or exactly what would happen when Speedy grew up. 

That was, after all, the idea behind the DCUG.  They could retell some of the best stories from previous years, especially those that were good ideas but just lacked in the execution, but they would have an end point in mind, and that would generate real, organic, and actually worthwhile change.  You could have old heroes step down and new heroes step up, and you could do it without torturing the originals and making everyone resent the new blood.  Anyway, I could go on about that forever.  I could, but it won't do any good because, of course, it remains just a dream.  The closest I'll come to it is in the DCUG. 

Instead, DC is going to try to have their cake and eat it too.  They're tearing a great deal down, but they're rebuilding on the same crooked foundations.  A lot of the same bad ideas from the current books are in evidence in their reboot.  All of the things that I hate about modern comics are alive and well in the future DC, or so it appears.  So yeah, I wish I could be excited, but I can't.  I will likely pick up the new Aquaman book, just to support the character, but I doubt I'll even read that for long.
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Offline Glitch Girl

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Re: DC Comics Reboot
« Reply #2 on: August 18, 2011, 01:07:43 PM »
I wanted to remain optimistic about this whole reboot/reset/whatever thing, but for the most part, I've found the whole promotional process to be chaotic and a tad depressing, like a step backwards in many cases.  There are even times when I don't think that the people in charge even know what's going on. 

I guess I'll see how it plays out, maybe tradewait a bit on some titles, wait for reviews on others. 
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Offline John Jr.

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Re: DC Comics Reboot
« Reply #3 on: August 18, 2011, 10:41:50 PM »
Like Benton I already talked a lot about it int TOF, so I'll just remember some points:
-It's a "soft" reboot, some characters will be rebooted (Superman, Wonder Woman), others won't (Batman, GL). So DC is still studying which stories happened and  which don't. I don't think it can be called a "fresh start" and an "easy jump on" point.
While I would hate a full reboot (I'm very glad LSH won't be very affected by the reboot) it would make more sense. If everything is new, anyone can hop aboard, but it's harder to do this when you have to discover how "Death of Superman" and "Identity Crisis" fit in the new continuity. 

« Last Edit: August 19, 2011, 03:57:16 AM by John Jr. »

Offline Pod 2.0

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Re: DC Comics Reboot
« Reply #4 on: August 19, 2011, 03:49:40 AM »
Yeah we talked about this alot over at ToF. I'm certainly disappointed but I do plan to give a few books a try, specifically Justice League, Teen Titans, and Superboy. I'll be keeping an eye of the Bat books too.

starting from scratch again.

Well it's not quite scratch. Some books (Green Lantern books, Bat books) have retained most of their continuity. But yeah other books appear to be restarting.

Offline AfghanAnt

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Re: DC Comics Reboot
« Reply #5 on: August 23, 2011, 05:11:36 PM »
Dislikes:
Superboy is unrecognizable as are several second tier characters (seriously I have no idea who this Wondergirl is but she isn't Cassie).
The timeline seems extremely too compressed to have happened in 5 years.
C-list characters seem to have been removed, replaced, or re-purposed (really Rose Wilson as Superboy's keeper and Karen Starr (Powergirl) as Mr Terrific's business partner is just pointlessly dumb. And where the #@$% is JAckson Hyde, Raven, Beast Boy, Steel and Donna Troy?).
The reversal of important character developments (Babs as Oracle vs Batgirl" - this is particularly disturbing for me considering how important Oracle has been to the DCU and to the idea that heroes come in different forms).
Giving Wonder Woman pants and removing this as fast as people started warming up to it - because you know she isn't Wonderful unless she's posed like a whore and wearing a bikini.
New characters just because (Bug, Lava Girl, and Big Purple Fist Lad have zero appeal to me as a life-long Titans fan. I don't mind new blood but when you've made the core of the team all-new,all-different and add new characters, I feel cheated because I read Teen Titans for Teen Titans not random new characters).
Wildstorm in the DCNU (I love the idea of Stormwatch as a title - it feels like the Authority/Planetary from what I've read about it).

Likes:
All-new number 1's and new creative teams (not going to lie I've ordered 3-months worth of JL, Action Comics, Teen Titans, Superboy, Stormwatch, and Aquaman)
Cyborg becoming a Justice Leaguer (despite what people are saying, it makes sense considering his history with the Superfriends show)
More diversity in the Justice League (two Koreans, four women, and 1.5 Black men - the league hasn't been this diverse since Morrison's run).
New Characters! (Element Woman and Lady Luck seem like they have a lot of potential and unlike what is being done with Teen Titans - I still know who the Justice League is and the additional of new characters doesn't feel so just because to me).
Action Comics with Grant Morrison (nuff said).
« Last Edit: August 23, 2011, 06:05:00 PM by AfghanAnt »

Offline cmdrkoenig67

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Re: DC Comics Reboot
« Reply #6 on: August 23, 2011, 06:03:25 PM »
I lost interest the minute the Doom Patrol was cancelled...And I'm not eager to see another rebooted Doom Patrol either.  A lot of DC history down the toilet again.

IMHO DC sucks!

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Offline BentonGrey

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Re: DC Comics Reboot
« Reply #7 on: August 25, 2011, 04:06:42 AM »
Wait, wait, wait...so, I've been doing a bit more reading about this, and I was wondering if there was some small chance that this reboot might make Batman books palatable to me once again, something that hasn't been the case since the surprisingly excellent run of Batman Adventures and Batman and Robin Adventures.  So, what do I see?  The Robin of the reboot is Damian (which I know some of y'all like), but this makes ZERO sense.  If superheroes have only been around five years, Damian can't possibly even be alive, much less be Robin.  Assuming that his origin is even REMOTELY like the original one, he had to have been conceived by Talia and Batman, who meet through the superhero persona....so, what the heck?  I know that this isn't exactly earth shattering news.  We've noticed several things that make no sense, but this really aggravates me even more.  Here's a pretty legitimate reason to do what I've been wanting DC to do for ages, and maybe even get Dick Grayson back as Robin, to hopefully go on to a better transition than he original did, but instead we get a character that I don't care for and who doesn't even make sense.  Bah.  It looks like DC has succeeded in strengthening my resolve on my boycott. :P
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Offline Courtnall6

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Re: DC Comics Reboot
« Reply #8 on: August 25, 2011, 04:33:34 AM »
From what I've read online Benton...Batman has been doing his thing for 10 years. No one thinks he actually exists...an urban legend. So apparently he's had time to have 15 Robins or whatever.
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Offline Cyber Burn

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Re: DC Comics Reboot
« Reply #9 on: August 25, 2011, 04:49:06 AM »
I'll say that:

 I would have hoped for more of a "start from scratch" type reboot.

 I am looking forward to seeing Hank Hall back in his own book, as Hawk.

 I am dissapointed that the JSA is apparently non-existant in the DCnU, they were my main ties to DC for many years.

Offline BlueBard

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Re: DC Comics Reboot
« Reply #10 on: August 25, 2011, 12:28:14 PM »
From what I've read online Benton...Batman has been doing his thing for 10 years. No one thinks he actually exists...an urban legend. So apparently he's had time to have 15 Robins or whatever.

For that matter, I would think that Clark Kent's been around for a lot longer than that.  He just didn't start out as Superman.
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Offline Talavar

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Re: DC Comics Reboot
« Reply #11 on: August 25, 2011, 03:56:19 PM »
As I said on the ToF boards, I'll definitely be reading fewer DC titles after the reboot.  A bunch of books that I read are getting cancelled, and being replaced with titles or creative teams I have no interest in.

That said, I will definitely check out Grant Morrison on Action Comics.

Offline BentonGrey

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Re: DC Comics Reboot
« Reply #12 on: August 25, 2011, 04:20:52 PM »
From what I've read online Benton...Batman has been doing his thing for 10 years. No one thinks he actually exists...an urban legend. So apparently he's had time to have 15 Robins or whatever.

Thanks for the clarification C. 

So...the very first year or so Bruce was Batman he got himself an illegitimate son?  Excellent....just excellent. :P
« Last Edit: August 25, 2011, 04:31:50 PM by BentonGrey »
God Bless
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Offline John Jr.

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Re: DC Comics Reboot
« Reply #13 on: August 25, 2011, 10:52:33 PM »
Dan Didio said (maybe as a joke), "Robin was a intern job" to explain how Bats had so many partners in so little time. Anyway, Didio and Lee said the reboot was necessary to get "younger, less-experienced and more relatable" heroes. But how can Bats be "younger" if Dick is still a grown up who was Robin, Nightwing and even Batman? Will Dick be older than Superman (who does look younger in the new Superman comics)?
 

Offline Podmark

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Re: DC Comics Reboot
« Reply #14 on: August 26, 2011, 12:03:52 AM »
I guess DC thought Batman was fine (read Grant Morrison) as, like I've been saying, the Bat books are almost untouched by the reboot. Off the top of my head there's three changes - Dick returns to being Nightwing, Barbara returns to being Batgirl, and presumably Stephanie will be returning to being Spoiler. And apparently all those changes will be explained in story. I think everything else is essentially the same. Even all the main writers are staying on (Morrison, Synder, Daniels, Finch).

I prefer it this way. I love most of the current Batverse and to reset it to the beginning would kind of suck. And you know creators would just rush to get Dick back to Nightwing, and introduce Tim etc.
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Offline BentonGrey

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Re: DC Comics Reboot
« Reply #15 on: August 26, 2011, 12:05:49 AM »
Bah.
God Bless
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Offline MJB

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Re: DC Comics Reboot
« Reply #16 on: August 26, 2011, 03:22:12 AM »
I have zero interest in the DC reboot. Not a fan of any of the redesigned costumes. The designs feel like early 90's Image characters.

Offline murs47

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Re: DC Comics Reboot
« Reply #17 on: August 26, 2011, 03:24:23 PM »
Click HERE for a revealing article about the reboot.

My favorite quote from the article:

Quote
“The truth is people are leaving anyway, they’re just doing it quietly, and we have been papering it over with increased prices,” DiDio said. “We didn’t want to wake up one day and find we had a bunch of $20 books that 10,000 people are buying.”
- Dan Didio

Offline BentonGrey

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Re: DC Comics Reboot
« Reply #18 on: August 26, 2011, 03:30:22 PM »
Heh, like I said, desperation.  That's all the more reason for them to be truly bold and do a real reboot, though. :P
God Bless
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Offline murs47

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Re: DC Comics Reboot
« Reply #19 on: August 26, 2011, 03:52:15 PM »
Agreed. But I think we all knew that. We comic nerds are a dieing breed.

Well, now that we're less than a week away from the reboot, what books, if any, are you guys gonna try?

My list is:

Batman (Scott Snyder has been nothing short of amazing with his Detective Comics run, I expect more of the same here.)
Justice League (I was unsure about this one, but after seeing some interior art, I'm giving this a shot. Some amazing art in there!)
Green Lantern (Sinestro as a GL and the star of the title? Interesting enough to give it a test spin.)
Aquaman (That's right Benton, he was the only bright spot in Brightest Day(pun intended) so I'll give this a shot.)
Animal Man (I like Jeff Lemire...I like Animal Man...so why not?)
Action Comics (All-Star Superman is my 2nd favorite Superman story so I'm looking forward to this title.)




Offline BentonGrey

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Re: DC Comics Reboot
« Reply #20 on: August 26, 2011, 04:56:16 PM »
I'm taking full credit for the fact that you're buying Aquaman, Murs. ;)

I still say that comic readers are a dieing breed only because nobody has made a comprehensive effort to bring in new readers.  DC is trying it halfheartedly now, but really, DC could never be the one to do it anyway because of the stranglehold that WB has on their non-comic enterprises.  Marvel's perfectly situated to create their own new generation of readers.  They just aren't doing it.

As for what I'll be reading, only Aquaman.  The new DC still leaves me cold, and the only reason I can bring myself to buy Aquaman is because I want to help support the character.  At the very least, I'm hoping that this whole thing will make DC and comic fans in general realize that Aquaman is a viable character.
God Bless
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Offline The Hitman

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Re: DC Comics Reboot
« Reply #21 on: August 26, 2011, 07:00:32 PM »
Ehhh... maybe I'm naive or something, but I'm not too terrible worked up about this shake-up. Honestly, DC needed to do something 'cause they had become too stagnant as a creative business. While there are some changes that I am certainly not thrilled about (yes, including the 90s-ification of many of the books and designs), overall I'm kinda pumped to see how this whole thing shakes out. Between The Ladyfriend and I, we are getting 50 of the 52 new titles (Blackhawks and Men at War hold no interest with either of us). Books I'm most looking forward to:

Animal Man
Swamp Thing
Green Lantern: The New Guardians
Hawk & Dove (just to see how bad the Liefeld art will get before the book gets canned)
Aquaman
Justice League Dark (closest thing to Shadowpact I'll ever get again)
Red Hood & the Outsiders (... what?!)
Batwing
DC Comics Presents (3 - 6 issue arcs featuring C-grade and lower heroes)

Offline BentonGrey

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Re: DC Comics Reboot
« Reply #22 on: August 26, 2011, 07:03:47 PM »
Ehhh... maybe I'm naive or something, but I'm not too terrible worked up about this shake-up. Honestly, DC needed to do something 'cause they had become too stagnant as a creative business. While there are some changes that I am certainly not thrilled about (yes, including the 90s-ification of many of the books and designs), overall I'm kinda pumped to see how this whole thing shakes out. Between The Ladyfriend and I, we are getting 50 of the 52 new titles (Blackhawks and Men at War hold no interest with either of us). Books I'm most looking forward to:

Animal Man
Swamp Thing
Green Lantern: The New Guardians
Hawk & Dove (just to see how bad the Liefeld art will get before the book gets canned)
Aquaman
Justice League Dark (closest thing to Shadowpact I'll ever get again)
Red Hood & the Outsiders (... what?!)
Batwing
DC Comics Presents (3 - 6 issue arcs featuring C-grade and lower heroes)
Emphasis Added

You sir, are part of the problem. :P
God Bless
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Offline The Hitman

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Re: DC Comics Reboot
« Reply #23 on: August 26, 2011, 07:06:10 PM »
You sir, are part of the problem. :P

I, sir, am a comic book masochist.

Why else would I have every issue of the Ron Marz run on Vigilante, quite possibly the worst series made in the last 5 years.

Offline Talavar

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Re: DC Comics Reboot
« Reply #24 on: August 26, 2011, 09:40:30 PM »
I'll at least check out Action Comics and Justice League International.  Depending on critical reception, I may also pick up Birds of Prey and Blue Beetle.

Offline John Jr.

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Re: DC Comics Reboot
« Reply #25 on: August 26, 2011, 11:26:04 PM »
I still say that comic readers are a dieing breed only because nobody has made a comprehensive effort to bring in new readers. 
Every time someone says this we hear how is "impossible"to get kids interested in comic books, meanwhile kid books are selling very well in newstands around the world, oh well...
Anyway, I'm not a fan of "THe New for the Nineties DC", but I'll check some titles:
Legion (my favorite super team, Paul Levitz writing, no reboot...)
Action Comics (I'm more than a little intrigued by Morrison's idea to get Superman back to his "Social rebel" days).
Aaaand, that's all folks.
 

Offline BentonGrey

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Re: DC Comics Reboot
« Reply #26 on: August 26, 2011, 11:36:08 PM »
I still say that comic readers are a dieing breed only because nobody has made a comprehensive effort to bring in new readers. 
Every time someone says this we hear how is "impossible"to get kids interested in comic books, meanwhile kid books are selling very well in newstands around the world, oh well...
Anyway, I'm not a fan of "THe New for the Nineties DC", but I'll check some titles:
Legion (my favorite super team, Paul Levitz writing, no reboot...)
Action Comics (I'm more than a little intrigued by Morrison's idea to get Superman back to his "Social rebel" days).
Aaaand, that's all folks.

Exactly JJ, it's just about making the effort to reach the right audience and BUILD a market, but you can't do that by just doing sensationalistic things.  You'd have to have a comprehensive strategy of marketing (movies, tv, games, commercials, ads, ALMOST like what Marvel is doing, but everything should point back to the comics and tie together), but you'd also have to put the books where kids are.  Make deals with Walmart and other stores.  When I was a kid I started buying comics because they were still in the spinner rack at the grocery store.  You get the characters and the ideas out there through your other media, then hook them by making a continued exploration of superheroes easily accessible.  Digital distribution can also make this easier, but you'd have to partner with places that kids GO online, just like in real life.  Ahh....I do wish that someone would do it, because I don't want to see the end of the American comic industry, and unless we really create a new generation of readers, that is precisely what is going to happen. :(  Heck, if Marvel would build on their Avengers cartoon and their Marvel Adventures Superheroes book more than they have, they could have a first step right there.

Also, no Aquaman JJ?  I'm disappointed in you! ;)
God Bless
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Offline daglob

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Re: DC Comics Reboot
« Reply #27 on: August 26, 2011, 11:45:03 PM »
Seems like many years ago I saw commercials for Marvel Comics on one of the cable networks.

Offline John Jr.

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Re: DC Comics Reboot
« Reply #28 on: August 26, 2011, 11:49:28 PM »
Here in Brazil, kids books and teen books outsells super-heroes by far and they're all sold at newstands and big stores. My daughter is a typical girl of her generation, she loves computers, internet and online RPGs, but, she reads her kid comics, and she can buy then in a newstand 2 or 3 bloks from home.
 
Also, no Aquaman JJ?  I'm disappointed in you! ;)
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Offline Podmark

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Re: DC Comics Reboot
« Reply #29 on: August 27, 2011, 02:12:55 AM »

Well, now that we're less than a week away from the reboot, what books, if any, are you guys gonna try?

I'll be trying:

Justice League (Johns and Lee sounds like a winner)
Teen Titans (Tim, Connor, Bart and Cassie are among my favorite DC characters so I'll at least give this one a try)
Superboy (see Teen Titans)

I'm also tempted to try out Batman, but I'll need to see a preview, maybe some reviews.
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